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OOC Kingdom of Ashes IV - Who's yo' daddy?
- Thread starter The_Universe
- Start date
The_Universe
First Post
EDIT: Thanks for the no-malice notification.Archon said:No insult intended, but when we didn't have a plan you made one for us. And that seemed fine by everyone but me, so i tried to come up with something else. That's it no malice just preferance.
Hash this out IC ASAP. I've got a lot of writing to do if you go your way.
Queen_Dopplepopolis
First Post
I think Archonus' plan is great... in addition to our own.
However, there are somethings that will need to be done if it is going to work out...
(1) Secret diplomatic missions: this serves as an opportunity for us to get support on the streets of Thanesport. Teleporting in and soapboxing our message.
(2) Extend those diplomatic missions to the men and women serving as Thanesport's defense: we DO NOT want to attack the city and wage war on a bunch of Lawful Good individuals that are simply defending their king. We know he's evil. They don't. They are not actively fighting against our cause so we need to do everything we can do avoid killing them.
(3) Plant our people in the defenses of Thanesport: get guys that support us into the ranks that way, when we do attack, we can have individuals there to attempt to convince people not already on our side to run, run away!
(4) DO NOT attack with the Bluestar's forces: Tain already tells everybody that we are cronies of Big Blue. Don't want to further THAT implication anymore than we have to.
However, there are somethings that will need to be done if it is going to work out...
(1) Secret diplomatic missions: this serves as an opportunity for us to get support on the streets of Thanesport. Teleporting in and soapboxing our message.
(2) Extend those diplomatic missions to the men and women serving as Thanesport's defense: we DO NOT want to attack the city and wage war on a bunch of Lawful Good individuals that are simply defending their king. We know he's evil. They don't. They are not actively fighting against our cause so we need to do everything we can do avoid killing them.
(3) Plant our people in the defenses of Thanesport: get guys that support us into the ranks that way, when we do attack, we can have individuals there to attempt to convince people not already on our side to run, run away!
(4) DO NOT attack with the Bluestar's forces: Tain already tells everybody that we are cronies of Big Blue. Don't want to further THAT implication anymore than we have to.
The_Universe
First Post
Good idea. Thanesport should definitely be a priority, but it couldn't hurt to do this in more locations.Queen_Dopplepopolis said:
You'll probably have to depend on the above-mentioned soapbox missions getting these people the right messages, as they're not exactly a discrete populace. However, good people dying for one cause or the other is essentially unavoidable.
That's interesting. Lots of bluffing. Would probably work better as a short term con, rather than a long term one. In the confusion of battle, people might not look as closely at those that are "reinforcing" them.
This might be unavoidable. However, since the army of Prydein and the Army of the Watch are currently counted among the Bluestar's forces...
Xath
Moder-gator
We can guess what he wants, so what do we want?
Ok. We have hashed out what we think the Bluestar wants. But now we need to know exactly what we want from him. We can't just go in with the generic idea of "troops" and "support" or we'll have our behinds handed to us on a platter. What kinds of troops do we want? Where do we want them? And how are we going to get them there?
Here are a few suggestions of my on:
The joint Armies of Prydein and the Watch which have come under control of the Bluestar, will be given to the jurisdiction of the Phoenix throne. This has several advantages.
1) The souls of all of those people would no longer belong to the Bluestar. (yes, Xath has some vested character interest in this fact)
2) The army is already armed, equipped, and south of the wall.
I picture that we would give them the option of serving the Army of the Phoenix for a year, or remaining with the Bluestar. Because of the circumstances in which they were sent over the wall, they would be more open to our accusations of the king's evil-ness, because they already know he's a dink. Can you imagine the reaction of Caer Albion, if the Army of Prydein and the Army of the Watch came to their rescue flying the banner of the Phoenix? Tell me that is not cool...go on...try...I dare you.
We will also want the ability to transport the troops about the kingdom, so some scrolls of Teleportation Circle should also be included in the deal.
I also think I have figured out a way for the Bluestar to travel south of the wall without us having to take down the wall. If this were to work, we could trade information of such a plan for what we want. This way, he can move about the kingdom, but his undead legions would still be trapped behind the barrier. More to come on this when I've worked out the kinks.
Ok. We have hashed out what we think the Bluestar wants. But now we need to know exactly what we want from him. We can't just go in with the generic idea of "troops" and "support" or we'll have our behinds handed to us on a platter. What kinds of troops do we want? Where do we want them? And how are we going to get them there?
Here are a few suggestions of my on:
The joint Armies of Prydein and the Watch which have come under control of the Bluestar, will be given to the jurisdiction of the Phoenix throne. This has several advantages.
1) The souls of all of those people would no longer belong to the Bluestar. (yes, Xath has some vested character interest in this fact)
2) The army is already armed, equipped, and south of the wall.
I picture that we would give them the option of serving the Army of the Phoenix for a year, or remaining with the Bluestar. Because of the circumstances in which they were sent over the wall, they would be more open to our accusations of the king's evil-ness, because they already know he's a dink. Can you imagine the reaction of Caer Albion, if the Army of Prydein and the Army of the Watch came to their rescue flying the banner of the Phoenix? Tell me that is not cool...go on...try...I dare you.
We will also want the ability to transport the troops about the kingdom, so some scrolls of Teleportation Circle should also be included in the deal.
I also think I have figured out a way for the Bluestar to travel south of the wall without us having to take down the wall. If this were to work, we could trade information of such a plan for what we want. This way, he can move about the kingdom, but his undead legions would still be trapped behind the barrier. More to come on this when I've worked out the kinks.
The_Universe
First Post
He probably likes having control of their souls, and you can guess he won't be likely to just give them up. However, you can be almost certain that any deal would result in them being used to further your own cause, at least for now. They are, after all, on the correct side of the wall, and ready to fight.Xath said:
Just bear in mind that they may not have that option without the forebearance of their current master. By all appearances, AB orchestrated a situation in which the vast majority of them were not simply slain and enslaved...but the price of their continued lives was, at least my implication, not proverbial pocket change.
And perhaps some more magic users who can cast the spell?
Now that's very intriguing. Post it, and I'll let you know if you're on the right track, at least. If I'm in the right mood, I might even tell you if it will work.
Just bear in mind that the Bluestar, given the ability to operate south of the wall, will keep trying to allow his hordes of undead into the South.
Laurel
First Post
Getting the soldiers released may be something we can ask for- but as with AB's it may not be as simple as old blue saying you are released and it may be an oath that goes beyond anythign that can be undone.
Plus as stated above, that is his force south of the wall. Until he can get more there.
Plus as stated above, that is his force south of the wall. Until he can get more there.
The_Universe
First Post
This need not be more than a jumping off point
Even if the Armies of the Watch and Prydein are forever lost to the King, his conventional forces still outnumber ours by a factor of at least ten to one, and probably more. Further, even his losses end with a net increase in his troop strengths, since the fallen, if not immediately destroyed, can be raised and pressed back into usefulness as undead thralls.
As such, we need to acquire as much as we can from the Bluestar. Tain is not fighting a limited war, and we cannot afford to fight one, either. He has loosed a force upon a citizenry that he is charged to protect that not only consumes, but transforms his people into something unnatural.
The Bluestar has equipment, and the ability to produce steeldrakes and other siege weaponry in foundries that the king does not control and probably cannot observe. Some of his troops are the walking dead, and some are not. The more troops we refuse to use, the less likely Jansten's rebellion is to succeed, so we want as many of the Bluestar's troops south of the wall as he is willing to share, including undead.
Though we will accept such troops, they must be employed carefully. If a force of undead troops can be gotten south of the wall, they should be used first at the Isle of Mourning, where we need not worry about corrupting those who could be our allies. That being said, any force used on the Isle requires intelligence, since part of their mission would be a search for the blades - a balance must be struck, something that can more than likely be taken care of after a basic agreement is reached.
A Hierarchy of Command must be established. We cannot expect the Bluestar to swear fealty to Jaine, and politically they are essentially equals. That being said, One of the two of them must be considered superior. Jane hopes that it can be agreed that the Phoenix king or queen can be considered the High Ruler, but expects that a deal would not allow it. If it does go down that way, She (and her rightful descendents) will be Sovereign in the lands that she rules, and He (and his descendents) in the land that he rules. Close advisors and nobles will likewise change position depending on where they are.
In contested lands (essentially anything currently controlled by Tain) the issue of command becomes more complicated. Each group must have immediate sovereignty over their own troops, but should a commander become incapacitated, a ranking member of the other "army" may take command. Since there's essentially no way to balance this systemically, ultimate command will have to be taken on a case-by-case basis.
In order to minimize potential command conflicts, the direction of the war (and when it "ends") must be clearly established by both sovereigns (and, of course, their advisors). Jaine's initial stance is that the surrender or elimination of the draconids, as well as the surrender and/or elimination of Tain would signal the end of the war. The Bluestar might have other ideas, but that's her initial stand.
As for specific forces and tasks, Jaine wants:
1) A force to help relieve/capture Caer Albion.
2) A force to slow the retrieval of the blades on the Isle of Mourning, or retrieve the Blades themselves.
3) Reinforcements/equipment for the force protecting Hyrwl and New Oceanus
4) At least one other expeditionary force, to be used for other important targets that may arise.
These tasks might include...
---Retaking Oceanus
---Capturing important places like Caer Melyn
---Reacting to other Draconid invasions
---Others?
5) She also wants a naval force of some sort, but the Bluestar is unlikely to be able to provide one. For that, she may have to turn to mercenaries, privateering, or some combination thereof.
That's the stuff that she/I can come up with off the top of the head. She is, however, listening carefully to what you have to say, so none of these are set in stone.
EDIT: She also wants forces to find the remaining spiritblades, as well as information as to why they are important.
Rather than go back to the IC thread, which is probably long enough, I'll give you the summary of Jaine's intitial opnion of what she wants from the Bluestar. That opinion can be changed, but as for a baseline, her desires and reasoning are as follows:Xath said:
Even if the Armies of the Watch and Prydein are forever lost to the King, his conventional forces still outnumber ours by a factor of at least ten to one, and probably more. Further, even his losses end with a net increase in his troop strengths, since the fallen, if not immediately destroyed, can be raised and pressed back into usefulness as undead thralls.
As such, we need to acquire as much as we can from the Bluestar. Tain is not fighting a limited war, and we cannot afford to fight one, either. He has loosed a force upon a citizenry that he is charged to protect that not only consumes, but transforms his people into something unnatural.
The Bluestar has equipment, and the ability to produce steeldrakes and other siege weaponry in foundries that the king does not control and probably cannot observe. Some of his troops are the walking dead, and some are not. The more troops we refuse to use, the less likely Jansten's rebellion is to succeed, so we want as many of the Bluestar's troops south of the wall as he is willing to share, including undead.
Though we will accept such troops, they must be employed carefully. If a force of undead troops can be gotten south of the wall, they should be used first at the Isle of Mourning, where we need not worry about corrupting those who could be our allies. That being said, any force used on the Isle requires intelligence, since part of their mission would be a search for the blades - a balance must be struck, something that can more than likely be taken care of after a basic agreement is reached.
A Hierarchy of Command must be established. We cannot expect the Bluestar to swear fealty to Jaine, and politically they are essentially equals. That being said, One of the two of them must be considered superior. Jane hopes that it can be agreed that the Phoenix king or queen can be considered the High Ruler, but expects that a deal would not allow it. If it does go down that way, She (and her rightful descendents) will be Sovereign in the lands that she rules, and He (and his descendents) in the land that he rules. Close advisors and nobles will likewise change position depending on where they are.
In contested lands (essentially anything currently controlled by Tain) the issue of command becomes more complicated. Each group must have immediate sovereignty over their own troops, but should a commander become incapacitated, a ranking member of the other "army" may take command. Since there's essentially no way to balance this systemically, ultimate command will have to be taken on a case-by-case basis.
In order to minimize potential command conflicts, the direction of the war (and when it "ends") must be clearly established by both sovereigns (and, of course, their advisors). Jaine's initial stance is that the surrender or elimination of the draconids, as well as the surrender and/or elimination of Tain would signal the end of the war. The Bluestar might have other ideas, but that's her initial stand.
As for specific forces and tasks, Jaine wants:
1) A force to help relieve/capture Caer Albion.
2) A force to slow the retrieval of the blades on the Isle of Mourning, or retrieve the Blades themselves.
3) Reinforcements/equipment for the force protecting Hyrwl and New Oceanus
4) At least one other expeditionary force, to be used for other important targets that may arise.
These tasks might include...
---Retaking Oceanus
---Capturing important places like Caer Melyn
---Reacting to other Draconid invasions
---Others?
5) She also wants a naval force of some sort, but the Bluestar is unlikely to be able to provide one. For that, she may have to turn to mercenaries, privateering, or some combination thereof.
That's the stuff that she/I can come up with off the top of the head. She is, however, listening carefully to what you have to say, so none of these are set in stone.
EDIT: She also wants forces to find the remaining spiritblades, as well as information as to why they are important.
Last edited:
The_Universe
First Post
There are in fact at least three forces south of the Wall. The Army of Prydein, the Army of the Watch, and whatever of the Bluestar's original forces Archonus Bluestar brought with him (Blue elves and giants, at least).
I would say, as of the moment, while they are each discretely organized, they all comprise "the Bluestar's forces." The former armies of the Falcon kingdom are flying the Bluestar's banner, and AB is, by all appearances, completely in command.
I would say, as of the moment, while they are each discretely organized, they all comprise "the Bluestar's forces." The former armies of the Falcon kingdom are flying the Bluestar's banner, and AB is, by all appearances, completely in command.
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