R&C Art, the Women of R&C

[Deekin]

It's a game in which many people play clerics of merciful gods, protecting the innocent from the rapacious forces of darkness, so I disagree.

Now, I don't think we need to see illustrations of Throthgor Fell-hand, barbarian master of the Desolate Wastes, feeding babies from a bottle, but how about a paladin selflessly interposing himself between a troll and some old villagers? Or, similar to Werebat's suggestion, a fighter tutoring his apprentice in battle?

It would be misguided to include these types of themes and images simply to appeal to politically-correct sensibilities, but I've been playing D&D for twenty years and I've had my fill of battle scenes. I now like to play PCs for whom battles are means to greater ends, and that's something rarely portrayed outside of novels.

From Unearthed Arcana

 

[Wyrmshadows]

It would be misguided to include these types of themes and images simply to appeal to politically-correct sensibilities, but I've been playing D&D for twenty years and I've had my fill of battle scenes. I now like to play PCs for whom battles are means to greater ends, and that's something rarely portrayed outside of novels.

QFT

But how could you show off your cool powers if you weren't fighting several times a day, EVERY DAY? :\


Wyrmshadows

 

[Lurks-no-More]

Whoops, nothing to see here...

Um, the dragonborn look pretty interesting, right?

 

[Haffrung Helleyes]

Well

I can't believe this long discussion hasn't touched on the biggest heap of unrealism in D&D art: The fact that female character illustrations don't reflect the use of CHA as a dump stat!

Let's have some really unattractive female barbarians, fighters, and wizards. Come on, when was the last time you saw a CHA 16 wizard? What is Miallee's CHA supposed to be, anyway?


Ken

 

[Werebat]

In all seriousness, do you ever see this in any form of entertainment when it doesn't immediately precipitate the slaughtering of the loved ones of said nurting males, leading to a bloody ramged of vengeance (or something similar).

Finding Nemo. That recent based-on-a-true-story movie starring Will Smith. I enjoyed both and felt that they were far more representative of what real-life fathers are like than, say, Gladiator.

You are right -- the media tends to focus on male nurturing only as a background for the "main event" of righteous violence. But this constructed image hurts real fathers in the same way that the image of the big-boobed chainmail bikini heroine hurts women.

It is nice and all to suggest that men and male oriented entertainment can be cuddly and emotional, but it just ain't so. Masculinity is as palpable and reala thing as femininity, and as much as we, as indicual loving husbands and fathers, can share our softer sides with those we are close to, the fact is that male entertainment is build around boobs and blood. Always has been, always will be and it isn't a bad thing.

I have children. I just fed and rocked my infant son to sleep. My love for him goes well beyond a willingness to stop and punish anyone who would harm him. I hardly think that I am an unusual father. Yet when I am hauled into family court I am treated to a system that automatically assumes that I am a devious, violent, child-molesting ogre -- and that my ex is a helpless, faultless, long-suffering "real" parent. Why is this?

That isn't to say that D&D can't make like other forms of entertainment that appeal to both, or at least try. But it is a rare gem of a film or book or video game that resonates equally with men and women, and even those still resonate differently with men and women.

Men and women are different. This fact cannot rightly be used to justify the dearth of images of male nurturing any more than it can be used to justify the dearth of images of female (insert traditionally masculine positive quality here).

- Ron ^*^

 

[Werebat]

My apologies. Consider the subject dropped.

Don't feel too sorry. You are articulate and hopefully inspired at least one person to do their own research and learn something.

- Ron ^*^

 

[Werebat]

From Unearthed Arcana

Good catch. So, there's ONE image.

- Ron ^*^

 

[Rel]

(insert traditionally masculine positive quality here).

- Ron ^*^

Kicking ass?

My perception is that there are plenty of images of female characters kicking ass throughout fantasy gaming. I also can't, off the top of my head, think of too many pictures of female characters being all that terribly nurturing in fantasy gaming.

I think that's because, thematically, a much greater portion of fantasy gaming focuses on kicking ass than it does on nurturing. I mean sure, there's sticking up for the weak and oppressed. But usually that involves seeking out their oppressor and...kicking their ass.

 

[Werebat]

What is Miallee's CHA supposed to be, anyway?

Mialee is female?

- Ron ^*^

 

[Werebat]

Kicking ass?

My perception is that there are plenty of images of female characters kicking ass throughout fantasy gaming. I also can't, off the top of my head, think of too many pictures of female characters being all that terribly nurturing in fantasy gaming.

I think that's because, thematically, a much greater portion of fantasy gaming focuses on kicking ass than it does on nurturing. I mean sure, there's sticking up for the weak and oppressed. But usually that involves seeking out their oppressor and...kicking their ass.

But this argument can be so easily turned around to support chainmail bikinis! They LOOK GOOD, and looking good is part of what fantasy art is about. Just like other equally implausible things in fantasy art like dire flails and spiky armor.

If we're going to ignore that fact or consider it less important than correcting the sociopolitical reality of sexism that is harmful to females, we have to be fair and do the same for sexism that is harmful to males.

Part of the problem is that we as a society are not ready to move sexism that is harmful to males out of our collective blind spot. It is treated as though it does not exist.

- Ron ^*^