D&D 5E Ranking and discussing Strongholds and Followers

[Chaosmancer]

So, the Kingdom and Warfares kickstarter got me thinking about Strongholds and Followers again. I haven't had a lot of chances to use the rules, though a DM of mine is running a campaign where we are using them (post-apocalyptic so we had to ignore a lot of the rules involving money, which has been harsh on my Warlock's Establishment). However, the little use I have gotten out of it did make me dubious about some of the abilities. A lot of this seems internally unbalanced, to the point of making me scratch my head in confusion in some cases.

So, I want to have a discussion about some of the rules, some of the things I've been considering to rebalance, and see if I can get some new ideas to help that process along.

And the best way to get people talking tends to be ranking things, so I'm going to do that. I decided on a 4-color system.

Red is bad, generally really bad
Orange generally lacking for some reason
Green is good, sometimes just because it is fun
Blue is incredibly, amazing, and all that.
I almost put a level above blue, but refrained. ​

The first thing to keep in mind is that there are four overarching types of strongholds. Keeps, Towers, Temples, and Establishments. I'm not going to talk too much about them, but they are a bit odd. Keeps are all about warfare. You get free units, units are cheaper, they can be used to defend you in war, they give martial bonuses to training with weapons or gear. It's a bit, and all focused on fighting and war. Towers.... allow you to "research new spells" by choosing some new abilities from a chart. They can act as a fortification as well, but that is about it. Temples have the Concordance system, but... I can't tell if it is meant to be exclusive to temples or not, since having a temple gives you a 30% bonus. They can also act as fortifications, but if Concordance is spread among more people (which I feel like it should be since it is a good system for anyone who has a higher power invested in them) then Temples don't offer much. Establishments give you immense amounts of gold, they can buy the abilities of other strongholds, they spy and collect information, but they have no stats for warfare, so they can be easily destroyed unless someone else is defending them.

I mention all of this, because getting a basic understanding of what these are helps explain some oddities in the abilities below.

Also to explain, Demesne effects are constant passives that your stronghold exerts over the land. Stronghold actions are like player lair actions, acting on Initiative count 20, but only if you are fighting at home. Then you get a "Class Ability Improvement" which you can use a number of times based on your stronghold level (1 - 5) and is refreshed after you finish a week long rest back home.

Barbarians

Demesne -

1 - Ale within the Demesne is particularly refreshing, bringing good cheer with no hangovers the next day

Starting with a green, this ability is just kind of fun. You can't get drunk and hungover while in a Barbarian's Demesne unless you want to. It isn't super powerful or impactful, but it has some nice flavor and I like it.

2 - Wildlife within the Demesne grows especially large and fierce, migrating to follow the camp (which the camp might not move)

Also Green, wildlife near a Barbarian's Demesne gets big and mean, fueling that primal state that is iconic for a lot of Barbarians. It specifically mentions the "barbarian camp moving" which... is irksome. Barbarian Camps (not to be confused with Barbarian Camps, because who could confuse that) are a special type of mobile keep. So, if your Barbarian built an Arena (establishment) or a Temple, that wouldn't even be an option. But, this fits with what an area controlled by a Barbarian could be, and I find it interesting.

3 - Poisons brought into the Demesne are neutralized within the hour. No such cowardly forms of death are permitted

A Blue, no poisons are allowed within a Barbarian's Demesne. Now, you might think that an hour gives someone plenty of time to get things done, but a Demesne is a 24 mile hex, so unless you can cover ground incredibly quickly then it is impossible. Also, this gives you some political clout, which might be weird for a Barbarian. I assume these abilities are not secret in the world, these aren't lost magicks you are uncovering. So, every Noble would know that a dinner party held by a Barbarian will not be poisoned, cannot be poisoned. That can be big.

Stronghold Actions -

1 - You issue a might "yawp" that causes all enemies within 60 ft to be frightened until initiative count 20 on next turn

I put this as a Green, it is a free free, within 60 ft, but as we'll see, there are a lot of abilities that are far far far better than this that people can get. Especially since Fear is pretty easy to counter and this only lasts 1 turn. Can't be resisted though which is good.


2 - You rage and all allies gain the benefit of this rage as long as they are not wearing heavy armor

Initiative count 20, you rage and everyone else rages alongside you. This is crazy good. First of all, it isn't just the party. Remember, this is a system made for warfare. You get armies, all of whom rage. It doesn't say how long this lasts, but my guess would be until a Rage would normally end. This is terrifying to come up against, which is why Blue.


3 - You cast Chain Lightning, DC 8+prof+con, this can be done while raging

A free spell, and a good one at that. Nothing to sneeze at for someone lacking ranged options. Also, it can happen while you are raging, which could lead to some interesting shenagins. Blue ability.


Class Improvement

Chieftain's Rage: Whenever you reduce an enemy to 0 hp, you can choose to make a weapon attack or move up to your speed. You can do this a number of times equal to your stronghold level and it refreshes on an extended rest.

So, yeah, this is Orange. I find it lacking. The weapon attack is free, and I know Barbarian's hit hard. But a third attack occasionally is nothing really special. And the free movement can be great for tactical movement, but... it just isn't that impactful to me. When you start you get this once a week. Are you really going to be impressed with "Once a week, I can move after dropping an enemy"? I don't think so.

I don't know what a good Barbarian ability might be though. My first thought is "Make a single attack roll against every enemy within your threatened area." Kind of a massive sweep of the battlefield. Or maybe an ability that makes a single even bigger attack than normal, like "Make an attack, double the damage dice for this attack".

You may think these sound OP, but wait til you see some stuff down the list.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Bard

If you've followed the S&F stuff before, you might know that Bard abilities are seen as very lacking, and I find that only sort of true. Their Demesne and Class Improvements? Yes. Their Stronghold actions though, despite some weird flavor, are really good.

Demesne

1 - Whenever the wind blows through the trees music plays. Hoofbeats make a complex rhythm

So, I know this is fairly "bardic" in nature, but I find it lacking because of the phrasing more than anything else. These Strongholds can be anywhere, but you need trees for the music, and every hoofbeat is a complex percussion solo?

And, this gets into a problem with S&F which is he stuck to the PHB classes. A college of Blades or Whispers bard isn't going to find these nearly as iconic to what their class does. This is orange, but I would simply rephrase it as "Music is easy to find, and even daily activities have the feel of a grand play or show" The butcher doesn't just chop meat, it is a performance of skill. The people laying the cobblestones swing and beat out a rhythm. I find that much better for what is intended here

2 - Folks that live within the Demesne for a week find themselves ending conversations with a rhyming couplet

Didn't we just do something like this? Yeah, this is straight orange. Not only is "everyone rhymes" annoying to me, but I can't imagine trying to portray this as a DM. I would need to come up with something entirely different than this.

3 - Thunder rolls when something dramatic is said. Ravens will dramatically alight on branches at the right time

Didn't we just- Yeah, doing the same exact type of thing for a third time is just aggravating. I'd almost make it red out of spite, but I will keep it orange.

Honestly, I feel like "bard's perform" was just taken to "make everything shakespeare as fast as you can" here. There is sooo much we can do with these. Maybe performances find illusions enhancing the experience, storytellers literally weaving visions in front of audiences. Maybe people find it easier to learn new skills, halving the time to gain proficiency in any skill or language they choose. Maybe all creatures that speak can be understood in a Bard's domain, allowing the free flow of information and diplomatic missions. Demesne effects can be so cool, and this just wasn't.

Stronghold Actions

1 - Until Initiative count 20, all bardic dice use their maximum result. Then music plays afterwards?

So, this is clearly a Blue ability. All of your inspiration dice, when used this turn, will give the maximum result. That is amazing. I'm just confused on why we also get the "and afterwards a root note followed by a note a fifth higher than the root" part of this. It... probably sounds dramatic, but I find it completely unneccesary, and again, not all bards are playing music all the time.

2 -Three piece band arrives singing your praises? Band has world class lute fingering, exceptional rhythm, and the vocalist has an unusually high voice? Until Initiative count 20 on next turn, enemies have super disadvantage to resist your spells. This takes precedence over all other abilities (due to phrasing, this cancels advantage they might otherwise have)

Ah, the Three-Piece band. I almost can't believe it is actually a blue ability, but if you ignore what I imagine is a very specific reference to a very specific band, you get super disadvantage against your spells, and since it is worded that they roll three and take the lowest, it cancels out things like spells resistance, making it insanely powerful. I'll just... have to give different flavor than random band showing up.


3 - You regain all inspiration dice

Not a flashy ability, and you could get them all back on a short rest anyways. But, Bardic Dice are incredibly powerful and can be used in a lot of different ways. Especially with classes like the Lore Bard who can expend two a round, this can give a lot of mileage. So, Blue, but barely.

Class Improvement

Encouraging Inspiration: While an ally has unspent inspiration dice, they get +1 to proficiency. This applies to a number of dice equal to stronghold level and resets on an extended rest.

This was so close to being good. So, how it works. You give your ally Bardic Inspiration. As long as they do not use it, they get +1 to all things they are proficient in. This applies to a lot, I grant. It increases Spell DC's, attack rolls, proficient saves, all of it. And Bardic dice last a minute, so it is essentially a +1 for the entire fight. But, this only works on 1 die to start with, and giving multiple dice don't increase it more...

I might be being too harsh on this one. It might be good enough for Green. But, a +1 if you don't use my thing, and if you miss something by 2, you have to balance using the die and succeeding here vs losing the +1 for every subsequent turn. Frankly, I think I would just make it simpler. "When the Bard gives you an inspiration die, increase your Proficiency by +1 until the end of the encounter. This ability cannot stack, and you can only use it a number of times equal to your stronghold level. Refreshes with an Extended Rest." I think that is a much better version of this ability that a) prevents confusion and b) feels better since you aren't holding onto a resource meant to be spent.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Cleric

Demesne

1 - Folks living in the Demesne are immune to Disease

Blue, not only is it flavorful, but it is useful to. No disease can find root within your people. That is huge. It makes Temples immensely powerful centers for controlling sickness. The only downside is that is removes plagues as a threat to a lot of campaign worlds, but I'm sure clever DMs can figure out ways to make them still impactful, and it gives villains a reason to destroy your stronghold. You are a bastion against the greatest blight of sentient life.

2 - The Cleric can hear the prayers of the people faithful to their Diety, as long as they are in the Demesne.

This really does nothing, but I gave it green for roleplaying ability. Every prayer sent up towards your diety goes through you. The Cleric will be deeply intune with the needs of their people, able to hear about suspicious activity or know when violent and haneous crimes are enacted against their people. And, subtly, it encourages conversion. Because this diety is actively listening, this cleric is hearing your prayers and responding. So much good stuff can come out of this is people are invested in their communities.

3 - While the cleric is healthy, the weather is fair. If the cleric is injured or suffering, the weather turns foul. This occurs as long as the cleric is in the same plane of existence

I was tempted to make this orange, but settled on green. Weather effects are typically meh to me. There isn't anything you can do with them. But, taken as a package, the weather showing the health of the Clerical leader, the one responding to all the prayers and ensuring the defense against disease? That is actually really good, and seeing the weather turn foul could be a massive sign for the populace. Also, it is left vague. "Foul" and "Fair" can mean whatever we want. So, it leaves us some thematic freedom.

Stronghold Actions

1 - All enemies in 30 ft save against the Contagion spell

Blue, 30 ft is short range for the abilites in this book, but turning a powerful single target spell into an AOE, for free, with no requirements? That is awesome. And thematic, since the diseases that cannot touch the common man are leveled against your foes. Good flavor here.

2 - Shafts of golden light pierce down from the heavens, ignoring walls and ceilings. All undead, demons, or devils within 60 ft, even if you are unaware of their presence make a Wisdom save or are annihilated.

Do I need to say anything other than Blue? It is limited in type, only undead, demons or devils. But, make a save or be destroyed, even if I didn't know you were hiding in that corner, or invisible in the rafters. That is super cool and super powerful

3 - You and all allies recover all Hit Dice and gain 30 temp hp

This one should probably be Green, but I made it Blue because I use Hit Dice way more at my table than most people. My players need to spend Hit Dice to recover on a long rest, still only regaining half, so they can get worn down quickly if they are in constant danger. But, this is a solid ability all the way.

Class Improvement

Manifest Divinity: When you use your Channel Divinity, all allies in 30 ft recover 3d8 hp. You can do this a number of times equal to your stronghold level, and resets on an extended rest

Man, I want to like this one more. There are a few clerics where this is very powerful, like the Life Cleric. But how about the Knowledge Cleric or the Forge Cleric, who may use their Channel Divinity when there is no combat. It is just wasted for them, and since you can't use it without the channel divinity. If they need the healing, they will waste the main effect of their channel to do this.

I don't have a good solution for this one though. Other than spellcasting, there isn't a lot that clerics share amongst themselves, and also, I would like an option for clerics that is healing, and one that is offensive, since some clerics are more focused on that. Maybe a bolt of energy that either heals 5d8 or deals 5d8 radiant damage? That feels closer to what I would want here.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Druid

Demesne

1 - Local birds and animals can speak common and elven. They enjoy talking to new people but will try and find the Druid to warn them of suspicious people.

This is a fun ability, but I have a nitpick. Don't make it Common and Elvish, just let the Druid pick two languages. Sure, Common is a great choice, but I would feel really silly as a Firbolg Druid whose little animals were speaking elvish instead of giant. But, on top of being fun and thematic, which is green worthy, this can make for an information network. Also, everyone can speak with animals here, which makes the people more in tune with nature I would imagine. It is a good ability.

2 - Nuts, fruits and vegetables grown naturally in the Demesne (not cultivated or farmed) act as Goodberries. They lose this property if taken out of the Demesne

Okay, I get why it says only things "naturally grown" instead of cultivated or farmed, but I think that is a bad design choice. The thing is, this is a stronghold. It could be a military keep, a temple, ect. And one big aspect of strongholds is they attract people, soldiers, farmers, artisans. This is civilization, not wilderness, but a Druid is in charge. And so, they will try and live in harmony, they will help the forest, they will cultivate and grow. Which immediately cancels this ability out and I don't like that. Let it just be that Nuts, Fruits and Vegetables grown in the Demesne act as goodberries. The power of nature is rampant here, it works.

And, it has a side effect. Sure, a lot of people might look at this for the 1 hp recovery, but I am looking at an entirely different aspect of goodberry. One goodberry counts as an entire meal for a person. Think how much free time people would have if a single berry bush, of which you ate a single berry, counted as all three meals of the day? I would almost make this Blue, except I don't think this would translate into more productivity as much as it would an increase in free time to commune with nature. But, it gives an entirely different feel to the place.

3 - No roads or trails last more than a day. However, allies and the units of allies can pass through as though there were roads.

One of those were a neat idea just doesn't work right. I've got two words. Game Trail. Animals make trails in forests, also, this place could be a tundra, or a desert, or a mountainside. This version is definitely orange. I would make it much simpler in theme, and much more powerful. "Enemies of the Druid find the very land fights their progress to more through it, often times leading them in circles or slowing them to a crawl. Allies and the Druid's own people though, find their way eased, moving at double the pace and gaining bonuses to stealth"

The land helps those it likes, and hinders those it doesn't. Easy to figure out and easy to implement in any environment, instead of worrying about roads.

Stronghold Actions

1 - Grasping vines rise out of the ground for 1 minute. Every enemy within 60 ft makes a Dex save or be restrained for the duration, making a new save at the end of every turn. At the start of every turn they take 3d8 piercing damage from the vines.

I figure this for a Green Ability. It is nice, an AOE grapple, dex save to avoid, free damage. There is nothing to dislike, just nothing that particularly wows me either.

2 - Cast Banishment on a single enemy, sending them to Arcadia if they fail.

This seems really good at first glance, but then you start looking at other Stronghold actions. A free banishment on a single target just isn't that good. I'd probably make it an AOE like so so many other abilities.

3 - Summon 1d4+1 Shambling Mounds, that fight for 1 minute

I had this marked as Orange originally, then changed it to Blue when I double checked the Shambling Mound's stat block. They are rather nasty opponents, and you can get 2 to 5 of them. They are slow, but, since you summon them you can likely summon them in advantageous positions. And, the Druid can heal them with Call Lightning while hurting enemies they are engulfing. It is just a really good synergy.

Class Improvement

Savage Shape: Your wildshape can be a fey, monstrosity, or dragon, including those with flight or swim, whose CR is half your level rounded up. You can do this a number of times equal to your Stronghold Level, refreshing on an extended rest.

This is an instance of Matt Colville listening to feedback. The orignal version of this ability was really bad, and I almost thought it was the same one until I realized he just hadn't changed the name. If you thought I was crazy for how I was ranking class abilities before this, this is a Blue. You can use your wildshape to turn into a Fey, a Monstrosity, or a Dragon. Ignoring the limit on flight or swim speed, and up to 1/2 level rounded up. Now, Dragons will pretty much never be useful to you. The lowest Young Adults you can turn into at 12th level, which is pretty late. But there are a lot of Monstrosities that can make for fun times.

The craziest thing though, is that this potentially breaks Wild Shape entirely. It says you are under all the same restrictions of Wild Shape, which would include no spellcasting, but you can turn into Centaurs, or Dryads and Pixies, and Wild shape allows you to continue using abilities as long as your new shape could use them. I could see an argument that a Druid turned into a Centaur retains their spellcasting, while gaining all the physical attributes of the Centaur. This could be incredibly broken. Which is why you only get to do it once per week rest back at your stronghold.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Fighter

Demesne

1 - Fortifications in the Demesne grant an additional +2 Morale bonus

I labeled this one green, but it honestly frustrates me. +2 Morale in the Warfare rules is pretty good, and a Fighter with a Keep can see that grow to +12 morale, since Keeps give +2 per level. This is insane. Those soldiers will never break.

But what if your fighter wanted to build a fencing school? Or an adventurer's guild? Both of those would be Establishments, and they wouldn't qualify for morale bonuses since they can't be used in warfare. So, if you follow the trope, you become insanely powerful. Fight against it, and you gain nothing.

2 - Menhirs (standing stones) appear in the Demesne and follow anyone hostile to the folk who call the province home, imposing themselves between locals and intruders

One big thing with this one, that makes it aggravating, is Menhirs are never defined in the book. You have to know that that is the term for old English and Celtic Standing Stones. That is just sloppy writing. What makes this an Orange ability is just how nonsensically vague it is.

If thirty enemies show up, do we get 30 door sized stones following them around? They follow them everywhere? Breaking through homes or into businesses to interpose themselves between people and the attackers. And, then what? Can they be gotten around? What does it take to break these magical floating stones?

Honestly, I'd find some other way to give mystic protection to the people, this one just doesn't work.

3 - Archers who train in the Demesne find their arrows go farther and strike more accurately

See Below

4- Edged Weapons in the Demesne are keener and do not dull

So, I gave both of these Orange for the same reason. I have no idea what they actually intend. The arrows go farther? Like, 1 ft, 20 ft, 100 ft? I have no idea. Accuracy bonus, like to the roll? What does "keener" mean? I know this is somewhat nitpicky, but especially after watching episode one of Matt's game, I feel like there was a much better way to do this

"All weapons in the Demesne are kept in pristine condition, with any damage roll using these weapons, treat all 1's as 2's. Ranged weapons go an additional 10 ft at each increment (short and long range)"

Stronghold Actions

1 - Until Initiative count 20 on the next round, any enemy who tries to cast a spell in your demesne suffers searing pain. They can choose a different action, or make a DC 16 con check to cast through. If they fail they take 1d6 per spell level of the attempted spell and the slot is wasted

So, this is really nice huh? Definitely Blue. Any enemy within 24 miles of you for six seconds can't cast spells, and if they try and fail, they blow up. Teleportation, healing, evocation nastiness, ritually summoning undead. If they are casting a spell, you stop it.

2 - Until the end of your next turn, all of your allies and your weapon attacks automatically hit. Roll anyways to crit fish.

This is one of those abilities I strongly considered making a new tier for. This is godly. Remember, this isn't just the party. This is every ally on the battlefield during a war, this is every individual archer while the dragon is flying over. Every weapon attack hits, no roll, no question. You hit. And this applies to you as well.

3 - You and all allies are restored to full hp

Oh, another Blue. Every single ally restored to full health. Instantly. Talk about a second wind. This turns a TPK into a victory.

Class Improvement

Fighting Surge: Whenever you use your action surge, every attack that hits is a critical hit. You can do this a number of times equal to stronghold level and refresh on an extended rest.

This was another ability that I made Blue, but that I almost wanted to make a new tier for. You use Action surge, every successful hit is an auto-crit. At low levels, this isn't too bad, but at high levels this could be devastatingly powerful.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Monk

Demesne

1 - Creatures age more slowly in the confines of the Monk's Demesne

Green, because it is fun. This is the Shangri-la ability. The world of the monk just extends, lasting longer than other places. It doesn't give numbers, but you don't need them for something like this.

2 - The temperature in the Demesne is always temperate, all year round, all day long.

And here is an Orange because of a boring Shangri-la. The weather is always boring... really? First of all, this just wrecks the environment, secondly, the picture for this stronghold is a snowy mountaintop, but for 24 miles it is temperate weather, you can't have snow. This is a bad way to do weather effects. I think it would be way more interesting to do something like "The citizens dwelling in the Monk's Demesne never suffer the effects of weather, no matter how cold or sweltering it feels, they act as though it is a mild spring day." Same exact effect for the people, but now it is clearly something different. It isn't that the weather is nice, it is that the people do not change with the weather.

3 - Violence of any kind in the Demesne has a 15% chance of summoning a Source of Earth, which will petrify someone to end the violence. The Monk can reverse this effect.

I liked this ability until I read it more closely, then it ended up going straight to Orange. That is because it specifies "violence of any kind". You know, like training, like what a monk would do? Suddenly, half of your class is turned to statues, because the floating rock had to "prevent violence" Or, how about a screaming match between a husband and wife, that is "violence of any kind" since it is emotional violence. One of you might get turned to a statue. And this effects a 24 mile radius, and possbily an entire city that has gathered around you. 15% sounds low, but with that many people you are going to end up with multiple statues a day.

Honestly, if the goal is to protect people from violence, give them an Aura of Peace. "All noncombatants in the Monk's Demesne are under the effect of the Sanctuary spell, using the Monk's DC." Prevents violence, and doesn't have that weird interaction.

Stronghold Actions

1 - Until Initiative count 20 on the next round, your flesh becomes diamond and you are immune to all damage except psychic.

Can this be anything other than Blue? You are immune to all damage for a round of combat. Yes please.

2 - You make 8 unarmed attacks against an adjacent enemy

Another Blue, on initiative count 20, you get to make 8 free attacks. Now, maybe you aren't adjacent to an enemy, but this are options you can choose to use, and 8 additional attacks is just really good.

3 - You regain all ki as though you finished a short rest

I hesitated to make this Blue, and really considered making it Green. What sold me was that a monk can choose to burn through ki fast during a fight, and they can have quite a lot of ki. Still, this could easily be a Green ability, solid but not the best.

Class Improvement

Focused Ki: When you are attacked and have unspent ki, you can choose to ignore any status effects of the attack (everything except for damage) You can do this a number of times equal to your stronghold level before needing to take an extended rest to refresh

I can't put this much above Green, and that is likely only because I saw a fellow player avoid being grappled by a giant at level 4 with this ability. It has a weird restriction in that you need to have unspent ki (I guess to keep yourself magical?) and it can ignore some really nasty abilities, grapples and restrains definetly, but also strength drain, or max hp drain. But, it doesn't prevent poison damage, which is just as common. It could be better, but I may just not be seeing it in the right light.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Paladin

Demesne

1 - Clear blue skies and warm sun dominate the area. Rain falls only at night and there are no thunderstorms

I just have a thing against these passive weather effects, which is why so many of them are orange. No thunderstorms? Why not, those are awesome and rarely terribly dangerous even back in medieval times. And, you can't do anything with this, it is just always nice and pleasant out. I'd do something completely different, give Paladins something else instead of always good weather, then again....

2 - Evil creatures in Daylight have disadvantage on everything

Wow, this does require some massaging depending on the themes of the campaign, but solid Blue no matter how it ends up working. If you are evil (in my mind, supernaturally evil, but maybe this does extend to other individuals like assassins) then in the light of day you are going to have a hard time saving, doing skills, fighting, sneaking, any of it.

IF there is a downside to this ability, it is that it double incentivizes groups like demons or devils to attack at night, and without darkvision that can quickly become bad for your Demesne, but still an immensely powerful warding effect.

3 - Paladin is instantly aware of the precise location any Evil or Chaotic creature with 7 or more HD. The range of this is 24 miles per stronghold level (same area as Demesne?)

So, I made this green because it is an ability that could serve little purpose. 7 HD is decently powerful, so it is possible the DM was going to let you know about that prescence anyways. But, the precise location of these powerful threats, that is really good. The range is an odd choice, because it says it is a number of hexes equal to your stronghold level... and your Demesne is a number of hexes equal to your stronghold level. But, it might have meant for straight lines, giving you some warning before the enemy is at your border. Still, potentially very powerful effect.

Also, I would allow this to be altered based upon the actual alignment of the Paladin, but I digress.

Special Note:By the way, if you don't think Paladin's got enough cool toys, think again. I haven't talked much about the Follower charts, but it is worth noting that they are the only ones who can get Winged Elves as allies, meaning they can get winged elf units in combat, allowing for flight and weapon usage. They also get special mounts instead of just special allies, including most of the choices from the Find Greater Steed spell as well as the Alicorn. Which despite being CR 5 is incredibly powerful with healing, teleportation, AC buffs, Truesight, flight, telepathy, and Pass without Trace for stealth missions.

Stronghold Actions

1 - Each chaotic or evil creature (your choice) within 120 ft must make a Con save or be grappled by mystic chains. It takes an action strength or dex check against the DC to break free on their turn.

I almost made this one Green, but I settled on Blue because of two reasons. 1) 120 ft radius is stupidly huge. This hits everything you could ever want to hit. 2) It takes an action to break free, unlike the Druid ability that is a save at the end of their turn. This means that if they fail, they are either grappled for the entire fight, or they lose an action breaking free. And possibly multiple actions if they have a hard time meeting the DC. It is limited to alignment again, but still, very powerful ability.

2 -Flying creatures within 120 ft make a con save or immediately land, and cannot take off again for 10 minutes

What is the greatest weakness of any melee build? Flight. A massive no-fly zone can be nothing except Blue. Also, even if you don't get to them for a while, it grounds them for 10 minutes, which is huge. The only downside is that this is not targetable. No one flies, ally or enemy, but this is usually going to be more helpful than harmful.


3 - Choose an ally, their armor becomes gold and grants a bonus to AC equal to your cha mod. This lasts 10 minutes.

Bonus AC is nice, stacking with every other AC buff there is is nicer, and this is going to easily be a +4 or +5 for the target, which is a massive buff. Blue all the way.



Class Improvement

Righteous Smite: Downgrade an enemies resistance to your weapon damage or radiant damage when you use your Divine Smite. Immune becomes resistant, resistant becomes normal, normal becomes vulnerable. You can do this for a number of smites equal to your stronghold level, and refresh on an extended rest.

This was the first class improvement I ever saw from this book, in a preview material, and it is still high on the hog. The downgrade of immune to resistant might be useful, but more than likely this is going to be used to make something vulnerable to your smite. The biggest single target Nova in the game, doubled. Whatever you hit is paste.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Ranger

Demesne

1 - Stags, harts, and other game are always plentiful, but they are larger and fiercer than normal

So, I gave the Barbarian version of this green, but I gave this one Orange. Why? Well, the first part is I like it more for the Barbarians, and theirs is less focused. Barbarians say all creatures, this specifies. Stags, Harts, game animals. Them getting bigger for more bountiful harvests, I can like that, but they also get "fiercer". These are Deer, and I know deer can be dangerous, but that is an odd image for "fierce deer"

I'd probably make it more general. All animals are larger, or maybe I'd make it more about the landscape, making it more primeval. I think it just needs tweaked

2 - Enemies of the ranger and locals must make a DC 15 Survival check to navigate the Demesne. On a failure they are attacked by 2d6 Winter Wolves.

Speaking about tweaking, I made this one Green, but I do have an issue with it. Enemies traveling through need to make a check, if they fail they are attacked. I like it. Why Winter Wolves? Again, I'm looking at "all rangers", what are Winter Wolves doing in the desert? Sure, maybe a mountain terrain it could make sense, but what about the plains? I could just change it to be a more appropriate creature, but matching the CR 3 of the Winter Wolves could prove challenging.

Additionally, while this is cool, it isn't something the players will ever see directly, nor is it something that I want to, say, run as an actual combat. Also, how many times do they make the check?

I love it, it just needs some work


3 - Allies treat the Demesne as Favored Terrain when moving through it, Enemies treat it as difficult terrain.

I made this orange for a very specific reason. I have no idea what it does. I could imagine that he means the Favored Terrain abilities from the Ranger Class, but this is very clearly stated to apply to military units, so what does it mean to have favored or difficult terrain for those? It doesn't say. I figure this is something that would require Kingdoms and Warfare to fully understand, so it gets orange, because I can't use it properly yet.



Stronghold Actions

1 - Until initiative count 20 on the next round, all enemies within 60 ft of you have vulnerability to your attacks.

This is really cool, vulnerability to all your damage for a round. Rangers are actually really good at spreading their damage to multiple targets, so this could get a lot of mileage. Solidly Blue I think, since it is equivalent to auto-crittng.

2 - You summon a 60 ft radius fog cloud that lasts 1 minute. You and your allies are not effected by this fog.

Hey, know what is awesome? Being able to see your enemies while they can't see you. This is Blue all the way, 60 ft radius of heavy obscurement that you and your allies ignore while your enemies are effectively blinded. And it lasts most of the combat. Super awesome, super fun and super effective.


3 - Until Initiative count 20 on the next round, all of your successful attacks cause bleeding. They take 3d8 slashing damage at the start of their turn, until they succeed on a DC 18 Con save to stop the bleeding at the end of their turn.

I debated on this being Blue, but I think it should be. Firstly, as I mentioned, Rangers are very good at hitting multiple targets, meaning you are likely throwing this bleed on 3 or 4 enemies, if not more with some shenanigans. 3d8 consistent damage is nice, while the DC 18 save is really steep.

The best part is, these all easily flow into each other. Create fog, bleed some tough enemies, then double damage on the survivors. This is brutal hunting, perfect for the Ranger.



Class Improvement

Chosen Enemy: Your favored enemy has vulnerability to your attacks for a number of damage rolls equal to your stronghold level. Refreshing on an extended rest.

Remember that awesome Paladin ability? Let's give a worse version to the Ranger. Orange for a few reasons. One, Favored Enemy is hard to work with, as always and has been discussed ad nausem. Secondly, depending on the interpretation "a number of damage rolls" is worse than "a number of attacks" since a DM could interpret that the weapon damage and say, hunter's mark damage are two separate rolls

Honestly? I'll overpower this. I'd give a special Hunter's Mark, useable a number of times per stronghold level, that gives Vulnerability to that specific creature (you can move the Hunter's Mark, but the special ability doesn't transfer) that feels more thematically appropriate to me.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Rogue

Demesne

1 - One ally per level of the stronghold can hide in the Demesne and no mundane or magical means will reveal their location. This does not work for the owner of the Stronghold.

This is Orange mostly because of assumptions I am making. I am assuming that most people are aware that these abilities are possible. So, it can be reasonable to assume that the enemy knows about this ability. Strongholds are made to be noticed, this is why I assume this ability does not work for the Rogue using it. You can't hide on your own land that everyone knows you own.

So, an intelligent enemy scries your ally, and they get nothing. This could mean one of three things, they are dead. They are on a different plane of existence. Or they went to their ally and friend whose land can protect them from scrying. Simple due diligence has them check your lands. So, this ability to hide people actually makes them more likely to be found by narrowing the scope of the search.

A better ability with the intended end result would be to send false positives. Your Demesne makes it appear as though this individual is somewhere else every time they are scried, while mundane tracking leads to red herrings and false leads. I think this gives a far more interesting ability and actually accomplishes the end goal of hiding someone. The enemy might assume they are hiding in your Demesne, but it is equally possible that they are actually traveling through the Endless Swamps to the south instead. Perhaps it even works if the individual in question is not within your lands, adding even more smoke to the screen.

2 - Creatures trespassing in the demesne have an overwhelming sensation of being spied on.

I dislike this ability for the same reason I dislike it on Beholders. RAW, it does nothing. A feeling of being watched doesn't do anything beyond possible paranoia, and it can be detrimental to the Rogue, because tresspassers will think you know things that you actually don't.

A better version? Actual spying. "Spies and Informants are everywhere in your Demesne, and your enemies will often find themselves under intense scrutiny as every eye belongs to your network."

3 - When a creature hostile to the rogue, and aware of their existence, finishes a long rest in the Demesne, roll a d20. On a roll of 10 or less, they take 3d8 damage from a hidden trap

So, I want to like this ability, but it is clearly an Orange ability. As much fun as it is to have random traps spring on your opponents when they wake up, 3d8 is an average of 10 damage. Anything you are likely worried about it going to have more health than that, and a quick short rest restores their hp back to max. It is an annoyance, not a real threat. And, it implies a lot of things that it doesn't actually do. Like, knowing where your enemies are and being able to reach them to set said traps.

I'm not sure what I'd replace it with though. I like the idea of a warren of paths and tunnels within your Demesne, allowing your allies and servants to get anywhere unseen and quicker than their enemies. That fits with the themes so far, but I'm not sure if it is as good as I'd like.

Stronghold Actions

1 - All enemies within 60 are marked. For the next minute when you hit a marked enemy you can remove the mark to deal an extra 6d6 slashing damage

A Solid Blue for a solid damage increase. Every enemy near you gets a mark, and that mark can double your sneak attack damage against them, or let you sneak when you otherwise couldn't. I've got no complaints here.

2 -Enemies within 60 ft are revealed, losing stealth and invisibility

This is pretty awesome, sure invisibility isn't super common but stealth is. A rogue's place gets attacked by assassins, and the rogue just calmly points out every single one of them, revealing them to everyone. That's cool and useful. Solidly Blue.

3 - Coin of Fate: each time you are hit, you may flip the coin. Heads the attack misses, tails the attack hits and you lose the coin

This is so thematically cool, but I can't rank it any higher than green because it is too random. You can get it, flips tails and lose it immediately without it doing anything. Honestly, if I take off the rose tinted glasses, this should probably be Orange. Maybe I'd give a number of retries based on the Stronghold level, just so it is almost guaranteed to work at least once. But it is such a fun ability.

Class Improvement

Vanishing Strike: After you hit with sneak attack you can become invisible. This lasts til the end of your next turn, or if you lose it by normal means. Number of times equal to stronghold level and refreshes on an extended rest.

I'm torn on this. There are a lot of times when I would see this completely wasted, and quite a few times when this would be super cool. All it really does is prevent you from being a target for a turn, which could be very nice. Could it be buffed? Probably, but it is fine as is.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Sorcerer

So, I'll do the honest thing here and mention that Reddit user Pheonicmusicman's post here :
Inspired some of my corrections and ideas. They are also the one who got me thinking about doing this big info dump. So, shout out here and at the warlock entry.

Demesne

1 - Curses, Blessings, and Oaths spoken within the Demesne have a 15% chance of rolling on the Wild Magic table

I am sorely tempted to rate this Red, in fact... yeah. This is pure Red. So, why is it red? Well, the first thing to understand is scale. You are talking about 24 square miles of territory and hundreds of potential people, over a period of years. 15%, that is a guarentee. Especially since it is 15% for every single oath, curse, or blessing spoken. Every time someone stubs their toe, or smashes their thumb, or wishes good luck to each other, there is a chance that wild magic happens.

And most wild magic is terrible. Auto casting damaging spells that will kill civilians nearby, aging, reverse aging, growing, shrinking, permanent changes to your appearance. random flight. And all from common everyday sayings.

Now, I don't want to say I don't like the ideas behind this. I'm actually going to bring this ability back, sort of, later, but this is just garbage that would tear your Demesne apart at the seems after the first year.

So, what to replace it with? Well, I actually really like Pheonixmusicman's idea of magic infusing the land so much that Artisans have an easier time making magical items. That has the same logic (an overabundance of magic in the air) but is beneficial instead of horrfically detrimental.

Also, it isn't thematically limited to Wild Magic sorcerers. One big problem with the RAW list I think is that Matt only worked with Wild and Dragon Sorcerers, which limited his themes severely.

2 - People who live in the Demesne for a season gain 1 random sorcerer cantrip. They lose the ability to cast it if they ever leave

I actually like this one, and I used to have it ranked higher before reading Pheonicmusicman's post. Then I realized that it is Orange and their version is far better.

See, why is this random? Because Matt was pulling on the Wild Magic idea again, but this should apply to all sorcerers, also, Sorcerer cantrips are a limited. So, instead, living in the Demesne for a Season grants you 1 arcane cantrip related to your daily life, that you can only cast in the Demesne.

This does a few good things. 1) They don't lose it, which I find important, it is just dormant if they aren't in the high magic area that is the Sorcerers Demesne. 2) It really drives home that magic is just spewing out of this place, everyone has magic. 3) The magic they gain makes sense. Shopkeeps get Minor Illusion to attract customers, farmers get mold earth to til the land, it corresponds to your needs and what natural magic you yourself might have, instead of simply being random.

3 - Raindrops in the demesne cast dazzling prismatic displays during the day

This is... just kind of boring. Sure, Rain gets prettier, but that does nothing and really doesn't scream sorcerer to me (unless they are a storm sorcerer). I don't know exactly how to change it. Maybe just make the environment reflect the Sorcerer's Bloodline, but I'm not sure where I would take it.

Stronghold Actions

1 - Cast three spells at once, using normal casting rules

So, this is Orange. But, it isn't Orange because it isn't powerful. Three spells in a row is actually very powerful, and off turn? That is potentially encounter ending. However, look at every single stronghold action we've listed. Does any other stronghold action take any resources on the part of the player? Maybe the Barbarian, but the benefit is everyone else getting your rage, not that you get to rage. Bard? They need to use Bardic inspiration, but the bonus is maxing the dice, not being able to hand them out.

This is the only ability that takes your long rest, daily resource, and expends it. And your stronghold gives you no way to restore that, unlike the Bard who can gain back all their spent dice.

Honestly, looking at other classes? I'd give them a free casting of a spell, maybe two if I wanted to keep that theme of multiple spells a turn. But, I don't like losing resources to use my cool stronghold ability when no one else does.

2 - For the next minute, all of your spells are heightened. You cannot heighten a heightened spell.

This is Blue, this is really cool. Every spell for the entire fight is auto-heightened, so a single enemy has disadvantage on them per casting. That feels like the overwhelming power of a sorcerer within their own Demesne, allowing them to batter down defenses. Solid Ability.

3 - You are wreathed in a Fire Shield, enemies take 4d8 instead of 2d8 from the effect.

I originally had this as Blue, but I downgraded it to Green. Fire Shield is a good spell, and a free one is very nice. Increasing the damage it does is even better. But, it only works if you are hit in melee. Sorcerers don't want to be in melee. It gives you an option for when you are down, but I prefer abilities that fit in dominating the fight from the start.

Also, I would just make it an energy shield, letting the various sorcerer's pick the type of damage it does to match their bloodline.

Class Improvement

Source of Magic: You gain a number of sorcery points equal to your stronghold level. These points only refresh after an extended rest.

This ability is horrible. It is the single worst ability any class gets. You have to remember, every stronghold starts at 1. That means this is a single sorcery point that does not refresh until you have slept at home for a week. If you are lucky, then it means a single extra use of metamagic.

Druids are turning into Dragons, Fighters are auto-critting, I'm not going to talk about Wizard's out of turn but hoo boy, and you get 1 extra metamagic, maybe.

Pheonixmusicman buffed it to cha mod+stronghold level, so you are getting 4 to 10 points, which is better. Personally, I'd go a step farther maybe something like "recover half your sorcery points" or "recovery all sorcery points" You can only do it a number of times equal to stronghold level. And it would feel as impactful as some of the blue abilties for sure.