Scaling spells by spell level

[Sadrik]

Do you like spells auto scaling? So take a level 20 Magic-User casts a fireball for instance in a 1e game does 20d6 damage, it auto scales. In 3e it maxed out at 10d6. What about in a 5e game should a fireball do 5d6 and then when memorized in a higher level slot do +2d6 damage for instance.

Cure Wounds does 1d8+WIS, and when memorized in a higher level slot adds +1d8?

Lots of applications for this actually.

How far should this go? Invisibility for instance, and each level granting more powerful version. Summon monster... Polymorph, Wildshape and on down the line with lots of things.

So yes you do like it or no it should auto-scale?

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I prefer autiscaling, though not necessarily at a 1:1 pace.

I'd also like to see fewer spells know but with casters learning more "spell tricks"- making the spells more flexible.

 

[Obryn]

Autoscaling is one of the key issues that makes for "linear fighters/quadratic wizards."

I think something needs to be done about it. Changing up spell levels sounds like an interesting way to do it.

-O

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

I think that the "memorize with a higher level spell slot for greater performance" is an intriguing approach. It seems to me to provide both flexibility and balance.

 

[Sadrik]

Autoscaling is one of the key issues that makes for "linear fighters/quadratic wizards."

I think something needs to be done about it. Changing up spell levels sounds like an interesting way to do it.

-O

Curiously this was in the first play test but was removed in the second play test... I very much conseptually like the scale with a higher spell slots. Saves space in the PHB too at least in some cases. No needed for two or more versions of a spell (invisibility and greater invisibility or summon monster 1-9 for instance). Hopefully play test three will include this concept again.

 

[lutecius]

I prefer things to scale through spell level but (like many other things) it works better with spontaneous casting (ie 3e sorcerer or spell points).

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

I prefer things to scale through spell level but (like many other things) it works better with spontaneous casting (ie 3e sorcerer or spell points).

I kind of agree - I think an ideal spell system would have fairly open spells (like a "fire" spell or a "teleport" spell) that can scale with the power of the caster and how much effort/MP he's putting into casting it. Heck, you might go from level 1 to level 20 without learning any new spells at all - you just become more adept at the ones you started with.

But when you're using a Vancian spell system, you might as well go all in with it and make the spells static. A wizard gets more powerful because he can cast higher-level spells, not because his low-level spells become stronger. (Boosting spell power with higher-level slots is a cool idea, but in practice would probably necessarily involve something complex like 3e's metamagic feats.)

 

[Black Knight Irios]

I can imagine a system where both types of scaling apply.

Some aspects scale with caster level to a certain cap probably with a rather slow progressin rate.
If the caster wants a more powerful version he has to use a higher spell slot and again there could be some upscaling by caster level as well.

Fireball 3rd Level
5d6 + 1d6 for every 3 caster levels above 5, max +3d6.

Fireball 5th Level
7d6 + 1d6 for every 2 caster levels above 9, max +4d6.
When you cast fireball you can choose to have it manifest as a cone, a line or drop the ball.

Something like that. Other aspects might scale as well like range, size of the area/etc. The bumbers are probably off but the correct numbers are not the point of the example.

 

[Starfox]

I voted auto-scaling, because in my experience everything - fighters included - scales. So if you want scaling at all, spellcasters have to scale too, and its easier to do so automatically.

If fighters don't scale fast enough to keep up, add more magic items. Fighters are the ultimate weapon-carriers.

Of course, for some games (like Call of Chuthulu) you don't want things to scale - and then you don't want scaling spells/powers/weapons/whatever.

 

[Yora]

That's a loaded poll.

I prefer scaling by spell points.