D&D 5E Shields and Somatic Components: Will you play it "as is?"

[Plaguescarred]

The devs have ruled that the holy symnol can be used as foci while wielding a weapon and a shield. For all others, there is always the War Caster feat.

 

[ppaladin123]

During the play test, I had a big issue with the (ever-changing) way foci were being presented, because everyone could use them one-handed, except the bard. Well, the bard *could*, but it was silly (you didn't play your lute to get the benefit, you just held it out and shook it at the opponent).

When released, the game had made changes, both with what the focus did, and that it was essentially interchangeable with a material components pouch. Despite their training in musical instruments, I think that many bards will naturally take the pouch instead because conceptually it only requires one hand.

I've not seen enough bards in lay to have a clear sense of this. So, problem solved, I guess, but it still doesn't feel fully satisfactory.

I think my bard might use maracas or a tamborine.

 

[Kobold Stew]

I was going to post the very same thing! People get stuck in a rut thinking every bard has to use a lute. If you are looking for ideas for musical instruments for bards, consider checking out the http://mim.org/ for pictures. Many of them can be used hands free, one handed, etc.

In 3.5 I once played a bard whose "instrument" was cocktail shakers, and at the end of each combat the players would enjoy a drink. That was silly, though. Of course alternatives exist and can be done. But let's look at the list provided in the PHB: ten instruments are itemized -- ten -- of which only two can plausibly be played one-handed, though they aren't by real-world musicians.

It's not the case that players are unimaginative. The PHB has specified ten options, all of which in practical terms require two hands to play.

 

[Redcrow]

Jon ‏@DBassJon Sep 3
@JeremyECrawford can a Cleric or Paladin cast spells requiring somatic components when wielding weapon + shield emblazoned with holy symbol?

Jeremy Crawford &#8207 @JeremyECrawford 15h
@DBassJon I'd say yes if the holy symbol is being used as the material component of the spell, so yes if "S, M," but no if only "S"

I personally don't like that ruling, but there you have it.

I picture it this way... when a spell has both M & S components the S component involves holding the M focus component prominently like a Vampire Hunter in movies holding out a cross/crucifix against a vampire. If a spell only contains an S component, then it is more like a Catholic Priest tracing the sign of the cross with their hand. While a case could certainly be made for holding a holy symbol while doing the latter, IMO trying to do so with an emblazoned shield would just be too awkward and so wouldn't work. YMMV

 

[travathian]

It's not the case that players are unimaginative. The PHB has specified ten options, all of which in practical terms require two hands to play.

You just proved my point. Players who say "but there's only 10 intstruments in the PHB" are unimaginative. There are not ten options in the PHB, there are ten examples. Options are essentially infinite and only depend on the player and DM to agree to something they find reasonable.

Player: I want to use a tamborine as my starting instrument. Can it be used one handed?
DM: Let me check the PHB. Ok, it shows a drum would be 6gp, and a tamborine is pretty similar. Bards start with an instrument of choice, so I will allow it. Make it 4gp and 2lbs, usable one handed or two handed.
Player: Yah!

[video=youtube;Nat1V0DZoXg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nat1V0DZoXg[/video]

 

[Mistwell]

I think it might be fun to play a shofar as your instrument. It can be done one-handed, though most use two hands as they're not in the midst of battle. But the origination of this type of horn was for the battlefield, as a rally point, and it was probably done one-handed sometimes, with a weapon in the other hand.

[video=youtube_share;ZUg7rRpFGvA]http://youtu.be/ZUg7rRpFGvA[/video]

[video=youtube_share;9ht0ailWQf8]http://youtu.be/9ht0ailWQf8[/video]

 

[Ranes]

In 3e we typically played by the rules: you needed a free hand to cast spells with somatic component, so you had to take into account every action for freeing your hand (such as dropping or stoving a weapon and then retrieving it, or changing hands, whatever the action economy dictated). That's because 3e was highly tactical, and this sort of things mattered. No ting shortcuts like mace-straps or whatever, the tactical choices were supposed to be part of the game, so you either accepted this tactical edge of 3e or completely removed the issue of somatic components (for everyone, not just the cleric) without a need for explanation.

This is the way I've always run 3e and will continue to do so. Should I run 5e, I won't. The rules have eased up and my players would expect me to go along with that, which is fine.

In 5e I don't feel like I want to go back to that tactical detail, at least for a long time. So I am basically just considering somatic components irrelevant, except perhaps in corner cases when it might sound interesting to add some challenge (e.g. a character is completely immobilized, or is using both hands to holding something important, or to hold herself from falling).

Fair enough but magic is too big a deal for me to hand-wave away any of the component requirements. As you point out, they often serve the drama, more often than not in my experience.

Verbal components are actually the more interesting ones to decide about. If you enforce "full volume" required, you have spellcasters who can't cast spells while hiding, or who can't conceal their spellcasting while for example in a social environment. However this is not necessarily the right choice. It's just as valid to have a fantasy world where spells can be whispered, as a way to conceal them, or stay hidden while spellcasting; considering that you can always let the dice decide (i.e. request a Hide or similar check), I will probably allow this to happen. Completely removing verbal components on the other hand may have more significant consequences, for instance in the interaction with spells like Silence so I won't probably go that far.

In 3e we had options like Silent Spell, Still Spell, Eschew Materials. Given 5e still has V, S and M elements, I wouldn't be surprised to see the equivalent of 3e's feat options appearing (I don't know if any already have; I only have the basic rules, so far).

 

[Kobold Stew]

You just proved my point. Players who say "but there's only 10 intstruments in the PHB" are unimaginative. There are not ten options in the PHB, there are ten examples. Options are essentially infinite and only depend on the player and DM to agree to something they find reasonable.

I think we're talking at cross purposes. If the "smart" bard never uses a two-handed weapon, then something is wrong with the bard's use of instruments.

Bards are given proficiency in three instruments -- specific instruments, not classes of. That's one weakness. But my point stands -- instruments are deadweight for a bard, and it makes better sense to use a component pounch in almost every circumstance.

 

[GameDoc]

Jon ‏@DBassJon Sep 3
@JeremyECrawford can a Cleric or Paladin cast spells requiring somatic components when wielding weapon + shield emblazoned with holy symbol?

Jeremy Crawford &#8207 @JeremyECrawford 15h
@DBassJon I'd say yes if the holy symbol is being used as the material component of the spell, so yes if "S, M," but no if only "S"

I personally don't like that ruling, but there you have it.

I'm trying to make sense of that one too. If a spell requires a Somatic and a Material component and you have a weapon and shield, what is satisfying the Somatic requirement that suddenly ceases to be if you then turn around a cast a spell with only a Somatic component?

Do you think Crawford actually meant yes if "M" only but no if "S, M"?

Mearls' tweet on the same topic said as a free action you can stow your weapon in your shield hand then have a hand free to cast.

 

[Stalker0]

For all others, there is always the War Caster feat.

For all others using a variant rule. Its important to remember that when considering rules and balances, feats should not a main factor.