Superhero RPGS

[bwgwl]

If asked what Hero's biggest plus is though...I'd definitely say it's flexibility. You can do "almost" anything in the system...but more importantly, there are often as few as two and as many as seven different ways of doing something.

A game offering 'X' power is fine. A game offering 5 different ways of having 'X' power is great.

really, your quote above about HERO is just as valid for M&M.

both games are great. i'd give a slight edge to HERO on flexibility of power construction, but M&M is really close. that may have something to do with my having 15+ years experience with HERO and only a few months with M&M. but i still find myself coming up with power concepts in HERO terms first and then "translating" them into M&M. so far, i don't think i've found too much i can't do in M&M.

HERO also has a big advantage over M&M in emulating other genres besides supers. although others have used M&M for other types of campaigns, i don't think it supports such types of games as well as HERO does.

what i like about M&M is that character creation and actual play goes much faster than my experience with HERO. that is something that's not going to be a concern for a lot of people, but it's something that impressed me.

now, i'm not saying that everyone should stop playing HERO for M&M. it sounds like you truly love the HERO system and it works well for what you want. that's great. but at some point, you might want to take a closer look at M&M -- you may be pleasantly surprised with what it's capable of.

 

[bwgwl]

btw, Batman's "poof-i'm-gone" ability:

Teleportation +6 (move 30 ft as a half action, 60 ft as a full action; same as base movement rate), flaw (only to places he could reach normally, only when no one looking) [1pp/level] [total cost: 6pp]

you might be able to do it as a limited form of Super-Speed as well...

also, for Shadow's cloak: since it's only providing a defensive benefit and not necessarily armor, i'd buy it as Deflection with the Device flaw, or possibly as additional levels of Base Defense Bonus. (just to give two more ways to make the same thing... )

 

[Cedric]

Nice, when I have money to spend, I'll check it out. Is it a game you can play with just one book? Or does it really need multiple books?

Cedric

 

[Agamon]

Everything is all in one book. And there's nothing there that really needs more fleshing out. But there's some cool supplements coming out: Freedom City looks like it's going to be an awesome campaign setting. And Crooks! will be great for helping find some antagonists to go up against the good guys...

 

[Voneth]

Batman "Vanishing?" MnM style?

1. Teleport +2 (Flaw:shadows only) for 2 total points,if you want to settle for only 10 feet. However with GM approval, then it become a feat, hmmm titled "Mysterious Exit."

2. Incorpreal +1 (Weakness: light) [Extra:Invisible; Flaw: Limted (activated only while no one is looking);Power Source: Training; Cost 2 points], Another potential feat.

3. Super Speed +6 [Extra: Wall Climbing; Flaw: Limted (Only to somewhere you could normally get too), Limted (only while no one is looking); Power Source: Training. Cost 30 points]

4. Or the Teleport could be an extra of Batman's Super Dex.
Super Dex +10 [Extra: Teleport, Super Skill Blending; Power Source: Training; 60 points] for an extra point per level.

• (by definiton, Teleport only allows you to go to places that you can see or know well, so it would be GM call if that was all that different than "Where he could reach when no one is looking," in this version. Either way, you don't even have to have Teleport or Blending bought up to +10 You can buy them to make the power cheaper.

5. Energy Control +6 (Darkness) [Extra: Teleport; Flaw: Range (Normal to Touch), Flaw: Limted (Only to somewhere you could normally get too); Power Source: Training; Cost 6 point] Now he can teleport where he could possibly go and he "take advantage of the shadows" by declaring that his Obscure (what you get with EC (Darkness) works by hiding in natural shadows.
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As for grim and gritty?

If you take the sidebars of optional rules such as "Impariment" and "Massive Damage" and have almost all damage considered Lethal, things get ugly fast. You can also reduce the number of Hero Points players get or omit them.

In fact, MnM's sidebars are great, you can make the game more like D&D (hit points), or even further a field (like turning BAB and Def into seperate skills.) They even give suggestion on how to reverse the rolls so that the attacker can roll for damage instead of the defender for his Damage Save. etc.

This all being said, I wouldn't waste my time trying to covert a Champs player. There are reasons they are happy with their system, and for a lot of them the commonly listed "drawbacks" of the HERO are actually benefits.

 

[Black Omega]

I'll join in pushing Hero System 5th Edition. Very flexible, best for Superhero games but it also works very well in pretty much any type of game you feel like trying. Pulps to Golden Age to Dark age, four color to grim-n-gritty. Nothing against Mutants and Masterminds, but I'd only pick that if the main factor is wanting to use the d20 system.

Hero System's char creation can be involved and takes a little getting used to, but the reputation for long combats is overblown. Lower level combats can go pretty fast. High level combats last longer but no more so than the tough d20 battles I've run. My longest d20 battles are longer than any combat I've run for Hero System.

 

[Desdichado]

I guess maybe it's a style and taste thing. You say the fact that HERO allows you to come up with a super power that allows you to teleport 6 inches away is a good thing; to me that's just tedious.

 

[Black Omega]

I guess maybe it's a style and taste thing. You say the fact that HERO allows you to come up with a super power that allows you to teleport 6 inches away is a good thing; to me that's just tedious.

Since I don't see anyone talking about a six inch teleport but you, I'll assume it is a style and taste thing. I suppose flexibility can be a bad thing for some people. Though really that ability sounds like something that might pop up in the Mystery Men movie.

 

[Michael Tree]

Batman "Vanishing?" MnM style?

That's more of a MnM conversion of the Hero style of doing it.

A more standard way for Batman to hide:
- Batman uses the Bluff skill to get the person to look away, then uses his massive Hide skill to vanish and skulk away.

Alternately, you could very easily create a Hide in Plain Sight super-feat (like the Shadowdancer ability) for Batman.

 

[Michael Tree]

I guess maybe it's a style and taste thing. You say the fact that HERO allows you to come up with a super power that allows you to teleport 6 inches away is a good thing; to me that's just tedious.

Those aren't actual inches, but scale tabletop inches, each of which represents two feet, IIRC.

Still, IMO it's an overly complicated way to do what is essentially just a stylish description of using the hide skill.