The "I Didn't Comment in Another Thread" Thread

[Ryujin]

You know, Canadians will apologize about everything. Even about how much they apologize.

And what do we have for this abomination? CRICKETS.

Do we want an apology? No.

This .... topping ... demands atonement and reparations.

Hey, we declared war on Belgium over that reprobate TinTin and we wouldn't be afraid to declare war on you, either!

(Well, it was the Rhinoceros Party of Canada that declared war but we won AND got reparations. A crate of mussels and a case of beer! Yes, I'm a 'card carrying'* member)

(*We don't have cards)

 

[Malmuria]

An oddity of dnd fandom is that people are both avid consumers of media (including sci fi and fantasy literature) and yet whenever issues of race and colonialism come up are particularly and almost obstinately media illiterate. Seeing how a particular aspect of the game resembles and recapitulates real world racism is just a matter of understanding the genre conventions and tropes of racism in culture. This is the exact skill you need in order to create fantasy rpg content. In other words, if you ask some dnd fans, 'how do I create a Moorcock-inspired setting' they'll have no problems giving you a list of d100 ideas. There is a complete and relatively sophisticated understanding of how to see and replicate particular genre conventions. Yet if you ask them to recognize conventions and tropes related to racism, the response becomes 'huh? I just see an orc' (or whatever fantasy race).

 

[billd91]

An oddity of dnd fandom is that people are both avid consumers of media (including sci fi and fantasy literature) and yet whenever issues of race and colonialism come up are particularly and almost obstinately media illiterate. Seeing how a particular aspect of the game resembles and recapitulates real world racism is just a matter of understanding the genre conventions and tropes of racism in culture. This is the exact skill you need in order to create fantasy rpg content. In other words, if you ask some dnd fans, 'how do I create a Moorcock-inspired setting' they'll have no problems giving you a list of d100 ideas. There is a complete and relatively sophisticated understanding of how to see and replicate particular genre conventions. Yet if you ask them to recognize conventions and tropes related to racism, the response becomes 'huh? I just see an orc' (or whatever fantasy race).

Give you a bunch of ideas for a Moorcock-inspired setting? Sure, if it is a part of their experience (in this case as readers). Ask someone for whom it is not and they won't be able to help much.
Recognizing conventions and tropes related to racism isn't that different - they are also experience based. If you aren't on the negative end of them or don't deliberately study them, you're not going to easily recognize them or fit them in your perspective any more than ideas for a Moorcock-inspired setting for someone who has never read Moorcock. And a lot of white gamers, even ones who are avid consumers of media, are privileged enough to not be on the negative end of those tropes and conventions.
This is why movements to ban more in-depth education on these topics are so problematic. Same with denigration of liberal arts education or the (currently) oft mentioned "soft" disciplines that don't deserve student loan relief (according to some).

 

[Hussar]

You mean @bill91, that racism get propogated through ignorance and an inability to recognize it? Yeah, I’d agree with that. Couple it to a visceral reaction to any criticism that someone might just not understand the issues due to ignorance and you wind up with all sorts of dumpster fires.

 

[billd91]

You mean @bill91, that racism get propogated through ignorance and an inability to recognize it? Yeah, I’d agree with that. Couple it to a visceral reaction to any criticism that someone might just not understand the issues due to ignorance and you wind up with all sorts of dumpster fires.

And it's an issue with a pretty significant magnitude as well. We all do it about some things here and there, even those of us who are curious enough to look things up or are educated in at least some of these issues.
Then you've got to factor in just how UN-curious most people seem to be. What else explains the proliferation of people who say they are Star Trek fans complaining about how political Star Trek is?

 

[dragoner]

An oddity of dnd fandom is that people are both avid consumers of media (including sci fi and fantasy literature) and yet whenever issues of race and colonialism come up are particularly and almost obstinately media illiterate. Seeing how a particular aspect of the game resembles and recapitulates real world racism is just a matter of understanding the genre conventions and tropes of racism in culture. This is the exact skill you need in order to create fantasy rpg content. In other words, if you ask some dnd fans, 'how do I create a Moorcock-inspired setting' they'll have no problems giving you a list of d100 ideas. There is a complete and relatively sophisticated understanding of how to see and replicate particular genre conventions. Yet if you ask them to recognize conventions and tropes related to racism, the response becomes 'huh? I just see an orc' (or whatever fantasy race).

It is because the racism has no meaningful impact on their lives.

 

[CleverNickName]

It is because the racism has no meaningful impact on their lives

...or a directly positive one. A lot of people benefit from the privileges of their birth, and they can't abide seeing those privileges demonized.

 

[dragoner]

...or a directly positive one. A lot of people benefit from the privileges of their birth, and they can't abide seeing those privileges demonized.

Maybe, or they feel guilt or something.

 

[prabe]

There is nothing like an argument between people who say the answer might be no and people who say the answer must be yes.

 

[Hussar]

Honestly I think the whole “no meaningful impact” point is both probably the most likely and the most infuriating at the same time. People whose only experience of being any sort of minority is that two weeks they spent in another country ten years ago but still have these strongly held opinions about race and culture issues just push all my buttons at the same time.