D&D (2024) The Multiverse in the 2024 Players Handbook

dave2008

Legend
The paraelemental planes are shown in the 2014 DMG as well. I just don't think they were talked about.
They are discussed (from Chapter 2 of the 2014 DMG):

Between the Sea of Fire (on the Plane of Fire) and the Sirocco Straits is a towering firestorm called the Great Conflagration, sometimes called the Plane of Ash. Howling winds from the Plane of Air mix with the cinder storms and lava of the Plane of Fire to create an endless storm front — a wall of flames, smoke, and ash. The thick ash obscures sight beyond a few dozen feet, and the battering winds make travel difficult. Here and there, ash clusters into floating realms where outlaws and fugitives take shelter.

The border region between the planes of Water and Earth is a horrid swamp where twisted, gnarled trees and thick, stinging vines grow from the dense muck and slime. Here and there within the Swamp of Oblivion (also called the Plane of Ooze), stagnant lakes and pools play host to thickets of weeds and monstrous swarms of mosquitoes. The few settlements here consist of wooden structures suspended above the muck. Most are built on platforms between trees, but a few stand on stilts driven deep into the muck. No solid earth underlies the mud of the swamp, so houses built on poles eventually sink down into it.

A great range of volcanic mountains called the Fountains of Creation is home to azers. These rocky peaks curl from the edge of the Plane of Earth around the Cinder Wastes toward the fiery heart of the plane. At the edge of the plane, the mountains are also called the Plane of Magma. Fire giants and red dragons make their homes here, as well as creatures from the neighboring planes

The Frostfell, also called the Plane of Ice, forms the border between the planes of Air and Water and is a seemingly endless glacier swept by constant, raging blizzards. Frozen caverns twist through the Plane of Ice, home to yetis, remorhazes, white dragons, and other creatures of cold. The inhabitants of the plane engage in a never-ending battle to prove their strength and ensure their survival.
 

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dave2008

Legend
Yeah and I don’t agree with you. They should make the implied setting more pronounced. It should be mentioned you can freely change it, but I love my D&D lore.
Is there a reason that can't be in a setting guide or manual of the planes type book? I don't really mind the lore, but I think I generally agree with @Reynard on this one. However, it is not a big deal to me one way or the other.
 

Yaarel

🇮🇱He-Mage
Interesting: they dropped "Prime" from "Material Plane." I wonder why.
As far as I can tell, "prime" is a 1e oddity.

1e has in its Players Handbook:
• Positive MATERIAL Plane
• Negative MATERIAL Plane
• "Prime" Material Plane

Apparently, Positive and Negative were kinds "material" planes, but the normal material plane was the "prime" one, and the others ... secondary echoes.

gJ85uHeBy3olDeQGw3QrFxJZL1HIGou18y4uGM2sWTcIL3lL2vo6TpW4za6p9PR1yWORNGy57Whb0ieneO9CQdzAF3urmS_wBkMvIdo9YmOch7hgMdIdBuSGuieKWvtvy-Jdw_4




So where 5e 2024 has the three "Material Realms" (namely Material, Positive Feywild, Negative Shadowfell), it seems to be a 1e-ism.


Personally, I make sense of this as:

Ethereal = Force
Positive Ethereal = Fey
Negative Ethereal = Shadow

And "force" is weird because, like gravity, it is immaterial but is physical, and can physically push matter around. Force is part of the Material Plane.
 

Yaarel

🇮🇱He-Mage
I am tinkering with the paraelementals as where the damage types are. For example, Air-Water is the Lightning-Thunder "storm" paraelemental.

FIRE
• Fire, Radiance
AIR
• Lightning, Thunder
WATER
• Cold, Weapon
EARTH
• Acid
FIRE

Remaining are: Force (Ethereal), Psychic (Soul), Poison, Necrotic
 

Reynard

Legend
Supporter
As far as I can tell, "prime" is a 1e oddity.

1e has in its Players Handbook:
• Positive MATERIAL Plane
• Negative MATERIAL Plane
• "Prime" Material Plane

Apparently, Positive and Negative were kinds "material" planes, but the normal material plane was the "prime" one, and the others ... secondary echoes.

gJ85uHeBy3olDeQGw3QrFxJZL1HIGou18y4uGM2sWTcIL3lL2vo6TpW4za6p9PR1yWORNGy57Whb0ieneO9CQdzAF3urmS_wBkMvIdo9YmOch7hgMdIdBuSGuieKWvtvy-Jdw_4




So where 5e 2024 has the three "Material Realms" (namely Material, Positive Feywild, Negative Shadowfell), it seems to be a 1e-ism.


Personally, I make sense of this as:

Ethereal = Force
Positive Ethereal = Fey
Negative Ethereal = Shadow

And "force" is weird because, like gravity, it is immaterial but is physical, and can physically push matter around. Force is part of the Material Plane.
I am pretty sure "Prime Material" has been the parlance for most of the history of D&D.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend, he/him
Is there a reason that can't be in a setting guide or manual of the planes type book? I don't really mind the lore, but I think I generally agree with @Reynard on this one. However, it is not a big deal to me one way or the other.
I mean, ittwo pages in the PHB, which juat provide a framework for the Spells and such that reference the ooamology.
 


Yaarel

🇮🇱He-Mage
I am pretty sure "Prime Material" has been the parlance for most of the history of D&D.
Yeah, but it originates with the 1e concept that Positive and Negative are kinds of "Material" Planes.

In a 5e context, the Fey Crossing is the Positive Material Plane, and the Shadow Crossing is the Negative Material Plane. Dark Sun emphasizes these, where the Positive Material Plane is where the harmony of elements causes life, and plants flourish.

5e has a Positive Material Plane. But it also has a Positive Energy Plane that is strictly immaterial, that pervades all that exists.
 

Reynard

Legend
Supporter
Yeah, but it originates with the 1e concept that Positive and Negative are kinds of "Material" Planes.

In a 5e context, the Fey Crossing is the Positive Material Plane, and the Shadow Crossing is the Negative Material Plane. Dark Sun emphasizes these, where the Positive Material Plane is where the harmony of elements causes life, and plants flourish.

5e has a Positive Material Plane. But it also has a Positive Energy Plane that is strictly immaterial, that pervades all that exists.
Huh. The positive and negative aspects never occurred to me. I always took "prime" to mean that it was the core, the anchor of the reality.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
As far as I can tell, "prime" is a 1e oddity.

1e has in its Players Handbook:
• Positive MATERIAL Plane
• Negative MATERIAL Plane
• "Prime" Material Plane

Apparently, Positive and Negative were kinds "material" planes, but the normal material plane was the "prime" one, and the others ... secondary echoes.

gJ85uHeBy3olDeQGw3QrFxJZL1HIGou18y4uGM2sWTcIL3lL2vo6TpW4za6p9PR1yWORNGy57Whb0ieneO9CQdzAF3urmS_wBkMvIdo9YmOch7hgMdIdBuSGuieKWvtvy-Jdw_4




So where 5e 2024 has the three "Material Realms" (namely Material, Positive Feywild, Negative Shadowfell), it seems to be a 1e-ism.


Personally, I make sense of this as:

Ethereal = Force
Positive Ethereal = Fey
Negative Ethereal = Shadow

And "force" is weird because, like gravity, it is immaterial but is physical, and can physically push matter around. Force is part of the Material Plane.
It was prime because everything else revolves around it. Even the outer planes and gods are tied to the prime plane and wouldn't exist without it. The positive and negative material planes weren't echoes of the prime. They were the poles of the multiverse.

Interestingly enough, in 1e(and maybe 2e) there were multiple prime planes. Each was separate and not part of the single whole that 5e uses. Greyhawk existed in a separate prime plane than the Realms. Each prime also had it's own separate ethereal plane.
 

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