Tweaking rogue & Cleric for Heavy combat Campaign
- Thread starter IronArthur
- Start date
Thanee
First Post
IronArthur said:I´ve convinced my dm to let me choose my divine spells.
Hey, the first sign of reason!!! Maybe he'll see the light eventually!
Not in your DM's world...
In your DM's world, rogues have no place!
Well, that's actually something I can agree with. Of course, if your adventuring partners just stay with you... but then he'll find another excuse to screw you.
Maybe you can have an NPC via Leadership who'll craft the items for you, while you are adventuring. Of course, you'll pay him decently (that is full price) for the work to make it fair for him.
But in fact, I doubt this will work, your DM doesn't want you to get items tailored to your class, so he will screw every option to get those, I guess.
Bye
Thanee
Vraille Darkfang
First Post
I see from your title you're in Spain. Probably not a lot of DM's to go to.
Some things to think about:
First, do you like how your DM runs the game generally? I mean do you like how he runs the role-plaing of NPC's; the structure of adventures; or anything else. Or are you just playing in his game because it's better than nothing?
Do you like the DM (and other players) personally? I mean would you see them in a non-RPG setting; such as watching a movie? While it is not nessecaryto be good friends with the other people in your group it usually helps.
If the answer to the first 2 questions is yes (or even maybe): Here is some steps you can take.
Why does your DM not allow Flanking/Sneak attack. Does he not like it or does he not UNDERSTAND it. Flanking & Sneak Attacks can be very complicated and not the easisst thing to implement.
As for trap XP. You shouldn't get XP from a trap. A trap is an encounter the ENTIRE party can help to overcome. Thus the entier party gets an XP award for traps. That's also why there's a section in the DMG about traps & CR. Yep Traps have CR's; thus the entire party should get an XP award for defeating it. Does your DM give stroy award or bonuses of any kind (such as for good ideas, excellant role-playing, saving innocents etc)? If not, then all you probablly are doing is playing a style of game called Hack and Slash.
Actually from what you describe, that is exactly the type of game you are playing. There is nothing wrong with this. Just be aware that killing capacity is probably the best way to excel in that type of game and get the most enjoyment from it.
As a DM for a decade now (of many different RPG systems & Styles), I'd say your DM needs help in understanding the rules and how to best DM. Normally the best way to become a better DM is to learn from one (probably not an option in Spain). If your DM is not a completly stubborn bore incapable of realizing his own shortcomings, he should be willing to comprimise and learn to become a better DM.
I'd also recommend someone else in your group taking over the reigns for a session or two. Seeing the game from teh other side DM screen can sometimes do wonders.
In effect, try to make it a group effort for everyone to get as much fun out of this hobby as possible. After all, that's why its called a "Game"; we do it to have fun. No fun, why play?
As for your your Rogue-Cleric issue (which I don't think is the real issue here) Try a Ranger, go for ranged weapon feats (if you don't have the 3.5 PHB, I'd recommend downloading the Ranger part of the SRD & asking your DM to play it. The 3.5 Ranger is more balanced than its 3.0 counterpart & much more rogue-like. In a combat heavy Hack/Slash game a Ranger with Ranged weapon feats works better than a rogue. You'll get many of the rogue's skills, but be much better at combat.
Hope this helps somewhat,
Vraille Darkfang
Some things to think about:
First, do you like how your DM runs the game generally? I mean do you like how he runs the role-plaing of NPC's; the structure of adventures; or anything else. Or are you just playing in his game because it's better than nothing?
Do you like the DM (and other players) personally? I mean would you see them in a non-RPG setting; such as watching a movie? While it is not nessecaryto be good friends with the other people in your group it usually helps.
If the answer to the first 2 questions is yes (or even maybe): Here is some steps you can take.
Why does your DM not allow Flanking/Sneak attack. Does he not like it or does he not UNDERSTAND it. Flanking & Sneak Attacks can be very complicated and not the easisst thing to implement.
As for trap XP. You shouldn't get XP from a trap. A trap is an encounter the ENTIRE party can help to overcome. Thus the entier party gets an XP award for traps. That's also why there's a section in the DMG about traps & CR. Yep Traps have CR's; thus the entire party should get an XP award for defeating it. Does your DM give stroy award or bonuses of any kind (such as for good ideas, excellant role-playing, saving innocents etc)? If not, then all you probablly are doing is playing a style of game called Hack and Slash.
Actually from what you describe, that is exactly the type of game you are playing. There is nothing wrong with this. Just be aware that killing capacity is probably the best way to excel in that type of game and get the most enjoyment from it.
As a DM for a decade now (of many different RPG systems & Styles), I'd say your DM needs help in understanding the rules and how to best DM. Normally the best way to become a better DM is to learn from one (probably not an option in Spain). If your DM is not a completly stubborn bore incapable of realizing his own shortcomings, he should be willing to comprimise and learn to become a better DM.
I'd also recommend someone else in your group taking over the reigns for a session or two. Seeing the game from teh other side DM screen can sometimes do wonders.
In effect, try to make it a group effort for everyone to get as much fun out of this hobby as possible. After all, that's why its called a "Game"; we do it to have fun. No fun, why play?
As for your your Rogue-Cleric issue (which I don't think is the real issue here) Try a Ranger, go for ranged weapon feats (if you don't have the 3.5 PHB, I'd recommend downloading the Ranger part of the SRD & asking your DM to play it. The 3.5 Ranger is more balanced than its 3.0 counterpart & much more rogue-like. In a combat heavy Hack/Slash game a Ranger with Ranged weapon feats works better than a rogue. You'll get many of the rogue's skills, but be much better at combat.
Hope this helps somewhat,
Vraille Darkfang
DarkMaster
First Post
Funny, why would there be less DM in spain than anywhere else?Vraille Darkfang said:
ruleslawyer
Registered User
Well, I doubt there are as many as in, say, the US. Granted, I've no particularly specialized knowledge, but I didn't exactly see a plethora of gaming or even comics stores while wandering around Madrid, Barcelona, Bilbao, San Sebastian, Pamplona, etc.
So, IronArthur: I tend to agree with the other posters on this thread that your DM doesn't seem to have a nuanced view of "game balance." That said, given the sources you listed, I'd play a Cleric/Hospitaler, which should break his game nicely. The planning's easy:
Assuming 25 point buy (given your DM, that seems right!), you will have, after racial mods, the following:
Str 10
Dex 13
Con 14
Int 10
Wis 18 (16 +2 racial)
Cha 10 (8 +2 racial)
Race: Aasimar
Alignment: LG
Deity: Mystra
Ftr1: Mounted Combat, Ride-By Attack
Ftr1/Clr2: Extend Spell
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp1: Initiate of Mystra
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp3: Point Blank Shot
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp4: Persistent Spell
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp5: Rapid Shot
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp7: Precise Shot, Improved Precise Shot
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp9: Mounted Archery?
Just keep building, beg borrow or steal an enchanted bow, and use greater magic weapon on your arrows (or use GMW on your bow and get adamantine, cold iron, silver, etc. arrows). With +14 BAB from Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp10, you'll certainly have four attacks per round by 20th, even if you dip into sissy classes like Contemplative along the way. You've lost only one caster level (plus one for aasimar), so you'll top out at a nice high CL 18 if you take only "+1 caster level" classes. Plus, you get to use anyspell to cast polymorph, and since you are an outsider (!), you will get to change into a planetar. Welcome to being the mightiest cleric archer in existence. Persistent divine power + divine favor + planetar + righteous might = DEADLY. And all without magic items or rogue nerfs!
So, IronArthur: I tend to agree with the other posters on this thread that your DM doesn't seem to have a nuanced view of "game balance." That said, given the sources you listed, I'd play a Cleric/Hospitaler, which should break his game nicely. The planning's easy:
Assuming 25 point buy (given your DM, that seems right!), you will have, after racial mods, the following:
Str 10
Dex 13
Con 14
Int 10
Wis 18 (16 +2 racial)
Cha 10 (8 +2 racial)
Race: Aasimar
Alignment: LG
Deity: Mystra
Ftr1: Mounted Combat, Ride-By Attack
Ftr1/Clr2: Extend Spell
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp1: Initiate of Mystra
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp3: Point Blank Shot
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp4: Persistent Spell
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp5: Rapid Shot
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp7: Precise Shot, Improved Precise Shot
Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp9: Mounted Archery?
Just keep building, beg borrow or steal an enchanted bow, and use greater magic weapon on your arrows (or use GMW on your bow and get adamantine, cold iron, silver, etc. arrows). With +14 BAB from Ftr1/Clr4/Hosp10, you'll certainly have four attacks per round by 20th, even if you dip into sissy classes like Contemplative along the way. You've lost only one caster level (plus one for aasimar), so you'll top out at a nice high CL 18 if you take only "+1 caster level" classes. Plus, you get to use anyspell to cast polymorph, and since you are an outsider (!), you will get to change into a planetar. Welcome to being the mightiest cleric archer in existence. Persistent divine power + divine favor + planetar + righteous might = DEADLY. And all without magic items or rogue nerfs!
huh?We had only core rulebooks 3.0 publishedDarkMaster said:
But I could find some other players to run a 3.5RttToEE in the weekend,most of them are college students,so do I.
One of my pc printed a whole copy of SRD spells section
I printed skills and Living greyhawk 3e-3r conversions
I am not the only dm in my city,at least I knew another two。
Hangzhou is not a big city in China.
DarkMaster
First Post
That is not a good reference, there is not a lot of store in Montreal but we have a lot of gamers, They just know where to go to get their books.ruleslawyer said:
Sorry if I hickjack the thread last comment on that.
DarkMaster
First Post
what only one or two millionsBearfs said:
*Shrugs*
Im not really in the "Boot the GM" camp. If you are enjoying the game then the number of house rules or otherwise is neither here nor there. Generally you should only leave a game if you arent enjoying it (though strange house rules may cause this).
Personally I wouldnt play in such a game, because the GM is basically bullying you.
Dwarf cleric who specialises in archery would be my suggestion.
Majere
Im not really in the "Boot the GM" camp. If you are enjoying the game then the number of house rules or otherwise is neither here nor there. Generally you should only leave a game if you arent enjoying it (though strange house rules may cause this).
Personally I wouldnt play in such a game, because the GM is basically bullying you.
Dwarf cleric who specialises in archery would be my suggestion.
Majere
IronArthur
First Post
i´m playing with him cause it´s better than nothing.
Some time ago it was a very close friend from collegue, but now i understand that it´s life after rpg and he´s always thinking about rpg, ccg, warhammer...
Maybe it´s cause he wants more simple combat and we don´t play with miniatures, so without them it´s dificult to flank...
We play mostly a hack & slash game, maybe some of the players we will want a more sofisticated play(more detailed npc, more roleplaying, more history after dungeons..), but we know with this DM can´t be.
I live in san sebastian and they are 2 comic/gaming stores, and one of them is tiny.
Now i´finishing collegue so i´m thinking that i will have to enjoy my last rpg gaming sessions of my life...
i know that they are associations of rpg gamers around, but i don´t know anyone that it´s a member of one(and i think most of them play vampire, and i don´t like this game).
The problem we have in my play party is mainly that some players of the group have been DM in one session or two, but he is the one that has more of the books(main 3.0 and 3.5, faerun,some classbooks,..) and we don´t have any experience of roleplaying outside this group so any of us know other form of playing(my dm has played with other people before). The thing that i hate the most it´s that all of the adventures are buyed, downloaded & printed or like, so they are very lineal and we can go out of them.
I would like that he put away some of his house rule but i understand that he is incapable of think that is another form of play..
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