D&D 5E Zone spells and amazing damage potential

[Sword of Spirit]

Yeah...I don't think it's supposed to work the way he says it's supposed to work.

I had an NPC cast moonbeam for the first time last Friday. I had each of the PCs in range take damage immediately (I mean, the spell appeared right on top of them, it makes sense). Then I gave it a routine re-read during a break, and decided that it's probably only supposed to happen at the start of a character's turn, or if they first enter it during a round--not both. It just seemed pretty obvious to me that that is how it was designed to operate.

I assume designers are like everyone else and occasionally forget an earlier better decision in favor of a current worse decision.

 

[HarrisonF]

I presume this ruling would also cause cloud of dagger to double dip it's damage? So you cast it, it does 4d4 immediately, and then 4d4 on the creatures turn? This would effectively make it do 8d4 damage and scales at 4d4 per level, which makes it one of the best damage spells around.

 

[I'm A Banana]

ACTUAL vs. THEORETICAL abuse.

Has anyone in this thread ACTUALLY had a problem in-play with any of these spells? No? Then lets not wring our hands overly much about it at this point. It's something to keep an eye out for.

When we get some actual play experience that results in these spells dominating, maybe I'll pay some closer attention.

 

[Tormyr]

ACTUAL vs. THEORETICAL abuse.

Has anyone in this thread ACTUALLY had a problem in-play with any of these spells? No? Then lets not wring our hands overly much about it at this point. It's something to keep an eye out for.

When we get some actual play experience that results in these spells dominating, maybe I'll pay some closer attention.

The only reason I did not have a problem is because I stopped it after the first use.

Player: I cast spirit guardians. The four guys around us take damage and are slowed.
Me: Okay.
Player: It is now that guy's turn. He takes damage from spirit guardians.
Me: What!? You just did damage using that spell.
Player: It says when they enter for the first time on a turn or start their turn in the aura.
Me: Sorry, I am not giving out damage twice in a round for the same spell, and I read that as the creature having to do the entering.
Player: Okay.

That did not stop the player from using it and using it effectively. He saved the party's bacon with that spell on several occasions. The player had to leave our group for a while because of real life. He returned last night to our group and is going to roll up a new character.
Me: So is the halfling rogue Captain Roberts (an old character from a previous adventure) going to pop up again.
Player: I am going to play a Life Cleric this time. (His last character in the campaign was a War Cleric)
Me: I thought you were tired of playing a cleric. What changed?
Player: I actually was having fun with it, and I love spirit guardians.

 

[Sword of Spirit]

Yeah, that's the thing--those are already good spells without the cheesy interpretation. Moonbeam in particular is top tier for its level. Giving them crazy extra power like that is just over the top and makes the other spells feel like underachievers.

 

[Uller]

I think it is probably fair to say moonbeam is simply overpowered for a second level damaging AoE. I makes Flaming sphere look pretty pathetic by comparison.

 

[Sacrosanct]

This was mentioned earlier, but the way I read it, literally, is that it's the target that has to be moving, or it has to start it's turn in the area. Therefore, sweeping the moonbeam, or wheelbarrowing the spirit guardian halfling, won't have the affect some thinks it has. Only the targets that actually move into the area or start their turn there get affected.

 

[Skyscraper]

So imagine a halfling cleric in a wheelbarrow with Spirit Guardians up being pushed around by his team member on each of their turns while they take the Disengage action avoiding all attacks of opportunity.

Reminds me of the bag of rats trick.

(I assume you're kidding, of course.)

 

[The Crimson Binome]

This was mentioned earlier, but the way I read it, literally, is that it's the target that has to be moving, or it has to start it's turn in the area. Therefore, sweeping the moonbeam, or wheelbarrowing the spirit guardian halfling, won't have the affect some thinks it has. Only the targets that actually move into the area or start their turn there get affected.

Indeed. If you move the area into someone, then that person isn't entering the area.

Generally speaking, you can cast it on someone, and they won't immediately take damage for entering the area, because they didn't enter the area; then, on their turn, they take damage for starting their turn in the area. The ruling hinges on the assumption that someone will either start in the area, or enter the area on a turn when they didn't start in it. Potential abuse would be limited to a character running in circles (so as to enter the area multiple times on their own turn), or teams of wizards pushing the character into and through the area multiple times over the course of the round.

 

[Paraxis]

Reminds me of the bag of rats trick.

(I assume you're kidding, of course.)

Not exactly a bag of rats, but with this ruling it is an exploit.

I ruled on this when it first came up in the game and will stand by my ruling at the table, which is the "enters" part needs to be done with an action, movement, or reaction of the target pretty much just like an attack of opportunity being triggered.

But if I played Adventure League games, you bet I would be a halfling with spiritual guardians who lets his allies push him around in a wheelbarrow all night long.