D&D (2024) Can we have the sorcerer fixed now? (Plz, I beg you n_n°)

[Frozen_Heart]

I've seen a lot of love for the playtest sorcerer on threads around here (myself included). Gaining features as your resources deplete is a fascinating idea and could definitely be explored further.

The whole 'becoming a monster' theme is pretty unexplored too. I guess beast barbarian covered one aspect of it.

Weirdly playtest sorcerer kind of shares that theme with blood hunter.

 

[Remathilis]

I think the biggest changes* the sorcerer needs are

1.) Bonus spells ala Tasha's
2.) More sorcery points, or more ways to recover them other than long rest
3.) Metamagic gained more rapidly

* Assuming we are forced to work within the current general structure of the class for compatibility issues.

 

[Minigiant]

Sorcerer need some exclusive spells. D&D needs to man up, go back to 4e, and convert some Sorcerer powers into spells.

And if the Sorcerer is THE innate caster, it's time for..

Magic Eye Lasers
Magic Hand Blasts
Magic Mouth Beam

The Sorcerer should be the only caster that can literally vomit and sneeze magic aggressively at you.

UNLIMITED POOOOWAAAAH!

 

[MechaTarrasque]

I like added subclass spell lists and to make sorcery points only good for fueling subclass features.

In 4e they tried to break the "sorcerer vs. wizard" thing by giving sorcerers a different role than wizards, and in the 5e playtest, they tried to make them into more gishy casters than wizards. I suspect WotC will continue to try to break "sorcerers vs. wizards" by make sorcerers default primal casters (and they can grab other spells via the subclass spells).

Giving sorcerers some kind of gimmicky casting, because back in 3x, they had gimmicky casting has run its course. Due to backwards compatibility, they will probably still have metamagic, but I suspect it won't be any better than before (and probably worse), so you can focus on better subclass abilities. The only sorcerer "gimmick" in 5e that anyone in WotC seemed to like was the wild magic table, and while it would be cool if there was available in a more controllable way (say roll on the table when you use your top two highest-level spells), I think there would be too much wailing and gnashing of teeth for that to fly. The only other thing that would get support without alienating everyone else would be for sorcerers to be constitution casters (I mean, what sorcerer is known for being great at deception?) which would make them extra good at concentration spells. That being said, I do like the "reckless caster" idea mentioned above.

 

[Horwath]

1. Bonus spells are addressed in Tasha's pretty much OK. fixes the problems. Might add 2 cantrips per subclass
2. Sorcery points. Increase by CHA mod, recharge prof bonus sorcery points per short rest.
3. Make spell points variant default for sorcerer and just add Sorcery points pool to spellpoint pool.
4. More metamagic options.
5. simple weapons(for wizards also)
6. maybe light armor

 

[Azzy]

Needs more spells known at higher levels.

 

[Sir Brennen]

The shared Arcane spell list might address a few issues for the sorcerer, namely lack of utility spells and spell variety. Seriously, Twinned Spell is great, but there aren't a whole lot of single target spells for the sorcerer to choose from. I'm tired of spamming Chromatic Orb with Twinned Spell.

If classes also have some spells specific to them still, then add more single target spells for the Sorcerer!

Bonus spells per sub-class would help alot with low number of Spells Known. Since they did it for two sub-classes in Tasha's, I kinda expect this to be the new norm in 1D&D. They had them even earlier for the UA Storm Sorcerer, but dropped them in the final Xanathar's version.

If regaining resources on a Short Rest is still a thing, add Sorcery Points to that list of resources.

Optionally, give Sorcerers a class feature to use an Inspiration point as a Sorcery Point...

 

[payn]

• Too few spells known. The smallest amount out of all full casters. This makes the class harder to play than it should be, and limits the ability to cover a theme because there are just not enough spells.

I played a Sorc from level 1-17 and never felt like this was an issue.

• Limited class spells. A lot of the sorcerer class spells focus on combat and there aren't enough non-combat utility effects. Also there are basically no exclusive/sorcerer only spells. And most egregious, Dragon sorcerer can't turn into a dragon despite the spell existing in the game!

This seems to be the classic trade off for Sorc. No spell book prep, but a limited list. I felt like cantrips actually took the pressure off here.

• Too much pressure on sorcery points. Sorcerer features rely too much on sorcery points. There are too many uses for sorcery points and not enough of them to cast even a full day's assortment of spells and use metamagic, let alone use the other class features.

I love this feature and felt like it was enough.

• Limited Metamagic. Metamagic takes too long to come online and once you have it you have too few metamagic options for most of your career. Some options are nearly must-haves and some are too expensive for what they do. Some options aren't in the core book (like damage change)

This I agree with.

• Issues with subclasses. Almost all older subclasses have issues. Wild magic is too reliant on DM cooperation, Dragon magic works fine, as long as you choose a fire dragon... most older subclasses could benefit from bonus spells, and there are only two in core.

I do feel like there is room for improvement here.

• No familiars.

Yeap, this needs to change.

Some of this seems to be a lack of theme and/or variety. I do like having to make hard choices as a sorc and felt that was nailed down. I am hoping to hear some ideas folks have on how to expand there.

 

[Blue Orange]

I suspect as they keep adding spellcasting classes, they're going to get harder and harder to balance, and someone always gets the short end of the staff of the magi.

It was bad enough when you had clerics, who could heal, and magic-users, who couldn't but had better offense and utility spells.

Now you have clerics, druids, sorcerers, warlocks, and wizards, not to mention the partial casters like bards, paladins, and rangers.

 

[MoonSong]

I played a Sorc from level 1-17 and never felt like this was an issue.

I must admit it isn't universal. Some subclasses get more spells known, and some builds are very focused and don't suffer too much.

This seems to be the classic trade off for Sorc. No spell book prep, but a limited list. I felt like cantrips actually took the pressure off here.

In 5e, spell prep isn't a hindrance, but a bonus. So sorcerers are trading more spells known for the privilege of not having a bonus. So they end up losing both ways? And well, what I meant by class spells was spells in the class spell list. Diversity of effects, sorcerers lack access to summoning, dimensional, and longterm effects. Even utility QoL spells.