D&D (2024) Polymorph temp hp remain

[FrogReaver]

I think RAW this is the most important distinction in this case. Temp HP is granted by the spell. It doesn't specify as long as you remained polymorphed or during the duration of the spell. THOSE would be specifics overriding general "temp HP last until you finish a long rest".

Temp HP last until a long rest is finished. Like the heroism example, the last temp HP you got at the start of your turn don't disappear just because the caster lost concentration on their turn.

I firmly believe this is an oversight by the deisgners and Polymorph wasn't intended to give temp HP even if the spell ends, but currently that is what it does as written.

Oops!

Yea, I think oversight as well. Like if you look at world tree barbarian, they specify that when the rage ends the temp hp vanish. That’s an example of specific overriding general.

Temp hp in 2024 is typically treated as an instantaneous effect (glamour bard, false life, etc). To try and say that for duration/concentration spells that they are treated as an ongoing effect just because the spell has a duration is a big leap to make from the RAW, though understandable from a word/page count editing perspective. I’m pretty sure it was justified by the same argument here, that spell effects end when the spell ends, which is fine for effects clearly ongoing because of the spell, but it’s not a very useful an explanation when what counts as an effect ongoing because of the spell is in dispute.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Duration​

Temporary Hit Points last until they’re depleted or you finish a Long Rest.

Common sense doesn't apply to magic.

You looked up in the wrong place.

Duration under spells:

A spell’s duration is the length of time the spell persists after it is cast. A duration typically takes one of the following forms:

Concentration. A duration that requires Concentration follows the Concentration rules (see the rules glossary).

Instantaneous. An instantaneous duration means the spell’s magic appears only for a moment and then disappears.

Time Span. A duration that provides a time span specifies how long the spell lasts in rounds, minutes, hours, or the like. For example, a Duration entry might say “1 minute,” meaning the spell ends after 1 minute has passed. While a time-span spell that you cast is ongoing, you can dismiss it (no action required) if you don’t have the Incapacitated condition.

 

[FrogReaver]

Nope. Healing is always instantaneous.

Nope.

I am really really suprised how hard that concept is to grasp.

Healing and damage are always instantaneous effects.
THP and ability damage can be instantaneous or have a duration...

Again apples and oranges.
And this is the most friendly answer I have for those comparisons.

It’s a rather simple principle. There are effects caused by duration/concentration spells that don’t cease to be in effect when a duration/concentration spell ends. Healing and damage are prime examples of this. Something temp hp is very closely related to.

 

[FrogReaver]

You looked up in the wrong place.

A spell’s duration is the length of time the spell persists after it is cast. A duration typically takes one of the following forms:

Duration under spells:

Concentration. A duration that requires Concentration follows the Concentration rules (see the rules glossary).

Instantaneous. An instantaneous duration means the spell’s magic appears only for a moment and then disappears.

Time Span. A duration that provides a time span specifies how long the spell lasts in rounds, minutes, hours, or the like. For example, a Duration entry might say “1 minute,” meaning the spell ends after 1 minute has passed. While a time-span spell that you cast is ongoing, you can dismiss it (no action required) if you don’t have the Incapacitated condition.

Sickening Radiance causes exhaustion. Is your interpretation that the exhaustion ends just because concentration on the spell ends? Exhaustion was an effect caused by that spell. It has its own duration too.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

It’s a rather simple principle. There are effects caused by duration/concentration spells that don’t cease to be in effect when a duration/concentration spell ends. Healing and damage are prime examples of this. Something temp hp is very closely related to.

Closely related is not the same as equal.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Sickening Radiance causes exhaustion. Is your interpretation that the exhaustion ends just because concentration on the spell is reversed. Exhaustion was an effect caused by that spell. It has its own duration too.

Lets let me look it up...

When a creature moves into the spell's area for the first time on a turn or starts its turn there, that creature must succeed on a Constitution saving throw or take 4d10 radiant damage, suffer one level of exhaustion, and emit a dim, greenish light in a 5-foot radius. This light makes it impossible for the creature to benefit from being invisible. The light and any levels of exhaustion caused by this spell go away when the spell ends.

Yes. It even spells it out.

 

[mellored]

You looked up in the wrong place.

A spell’s duration is the length of time the spell persists after it is cast. A duration typically takes one of the following forms:

Duration under spells:

Concentration. A duration that requires Concentration follows the Concentration rules (see the rules glossary).

Instantaneous. An instantaneous duration means the spell’s magic appears only for a moment and then disappears.

Time Span. A duration that provides a time span specifies how long the spell lasts in rounds, minutes, hours, or the like. For example, a Duration entry might say “1 minute,” meaning the spell ends after 1 minute has passed. While a time-span spell that you cast is ongoing, you can dismiss it (no action required) if you don’t have the Incapacitated condition.

So your back to treating damage / healing the same way.

The difference being that THP ends at a long rest, and healing doesn't.

 

[FrogReaver]

Lets let me look it up...

When a creature moves into the spell's area for the first time on a turn or starts its turn there, that creature must succeed on a Constitution saving throw or take 4d10 radiant damage, suffer one level of exhaustion, and emit a dim, greenish light in a 5-foot radius. This light makes it impossible for the creature to benefit from being invisible. The light and any levels of exhaustion caused by this spell go away when the spell ends.

Yes. It even spells it out.

And if it didn’t spell it out? Would you say it ends then or not?

 

[UngeheuerLich]

So your back to treating damage / healing the same way.

I respectfully disagree. Healing and damage can never be part of a spell duration.

The difference being that THP ends at a long rest, and healing doesn't.

I think the THP wording is not good.

 

[FrogReaver]

Closely related is not the same as equal.

Nothing is ever perfectly equal so we are down to all comparisons, even closely related ones being useless. Got it.