D&D General Playstyle vs Mechanics

[bloodtide]

For me? It's about separation of responsibility, who controls what in that both DM and players have spheres of control.

I agree.

Going all the way back to the "backstory" things, I'm not a big fan of the Players having Gotcha Rules. This is where the players have a rule they use to disrupt the game.

As a DM I have created a world, kingdom, town, land for the game.

THAT is what I meant by "prep-heavy", a game in which the creation of the setting is a laborious affair deserving of being appreciate

And it is. And prep heavy DMs do it willingly, most often liking doing this labor. It does take time and effort. So the idea that a player just says "whatever" and does not appreciate it....well, that player can go find another game.

When the player uses a rule like "oh my character knows a guy and this happens as per the rules", it's disruptive. Suddenly it's, "well, ok, if the rules say so it must be so".

But few games, like 5E, back it up. they toss out one, nearly useless paragraph. And worse, a badly written paragraph. And it just stirs up more trouble then it is worth. The player jumps up, disrupts the game and says "As per The Rules, I say my character has an NPC Buddy right there!". And okay, a DM just nods. But then the DM has 100% control. So if the NPC Buddy says "oh sorry I'm busy" that is 100% allowed. Except the player won't be happy.

While I've never run prep heavy games if I understand what the term is supposed to mean, I also don't see why it matters or why anyone would feel the need to repeatedly make the claims that people who still support a style are just clinging to the past.

Prep Heavy games have always been an Unpopular Niche. This is always true with anything that takes time and effort.

Anyone can grab some dice and do some random game play making it up on the fly. Only a few want to do heavy prep, and even fewer can do it.

 

[Oofta]

Again, I never said this or even implied this.

@Emirikol said "the DM's creation of the setting is perhaps the most important thing the DM does". If that's the most important thing the DM does (not the only important thing, but "perhaps the MOST" important), that certainly sounds like something that would require labor (hence, laborious) and certainly deserving of being appreciated in play. (Why wouldn't players appreciate a DM's labors?)

You've implied it repeatedly. Maybe not on purpose. But when you state that a specific style of play is due to atavism (e.g. old and outdated preferences), that a person that creates a homebrew world feels like they consider of "deserving of being appreciated", then yes your comments have a derogatory tone.

I mean, I hope my work is appreciated and I believe it is. But I don't deserve anything. I earn it or I don't.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I haven't.

Then the fact that those rules exist in the current game isn't evidence that they have anything to do with its current popularity.

 

[soviet]

Then the fact that those rules exist in the current game isn't evidence that they have anything to do with its current popularity.

I didn't say it was. I merely pointed out that we don't know.

 

[Oofta]

I agree.

Going all the way back to the "backstory" things, I'm not a big fan of the Players having Gotcha Rules. This is where the players have a rule they use to disrupt the game.

As a DM I have created a world, kingdom, town, land for the game.



And it is. And prep heavy DMs do it willingly, most often liking doing this labor. It does take time and effort. So the idea that a player just says "whatever" and does not appreciate it....well, that player can go find another game.

When the player uses a rule like "oh my character knows a guy and this happens as per the rules", it's disruptive. Suddenly it's, "well, ok, if the rules say so it must be so".

But few games, like 5E, back it up. they toss out one, nearly useless paragraph. And worse, a badly written paragraph. And it just stirs up more trouble then it is worth. The player jumps up, disrupts the game and says "As per The Rules, I say my character has an NPC Buddy right there!". And okay, a DM just nods. But then the DM has 100% control. So if the NPC Buddy says "oh sorry I'm busy" that is 100% allowed. Except the player won't be happy.


Prep Heavy games have always been an Unpopular Niche. This is always true with anything that takes time and effort.

Anyone can grab some dice and do some random game play making it up on the fly. Only a few want to do heavy prep, and even fewer can do it.

I'm not sure that homebrew worlds are that uncommon. Most estimates I've seen are that 30-50% of all campaigns are set in homebrew worlds.

 

[bloodtide]

I'm not sure that homebrew worlds are that uncommon. Most estimates I've seen are that 30-50% of all campaigns are set in homebrew worlds.

But Homebrew does not always mean heavy prep. Plenty of Homebrew games are improv games and no prep games.

 

[Baron Opal II]

Haven't you said, several times, that you're games set in the campaign world that you authored for the past 20+ years?

How is that NOT prep-heavy? You have 25 years of prepped notes to refer to.

Just for me, having a similar situation, it's not prep-heavy because I've already prepped. If they go to places or situations where there are already notes, well, there it is. I don't need to prepare that. If the go someplace new, then I need to think about that.

Has there been a lot of preparation? Certainly. Am I doing a lot of preparation before each game? No. It's an additive process.

 

[Oofta]

But Homebrew does not always mean heavy prep. Plenty of Homebrew games are improv games and no prep games.

And that's where I don't understand what "heavy prep" really means. I have a homebrew world. I don't spend a lot of time on prep for games yet I was told that it was heavy prep. On the other hand I know people who spend a ton of time running modules that spend far more time on prep than I do because the games are heavy on dungeon crawls and similar.

 

[prabe]

And that's where I don't understand what "heavy prep" really means. I have a homebrew world. I don't spend a lot of time on prep for games yet I was told that it was heavy prep. On the other hand I know people who spend a ton of time running modules that spend far more time on prep than I do because the games are heavy on dungeon crawls and similar.

As I said before, whether I'm running a "heavy-prep" game will depend on what and when and how you look. I've put some work into my setting, I've asked players for input, there's a lot of work that happens before the start of a campaign (and a somewhat smaller bolus whenever I frame in a situation) but while a thing is playing out there's not much per-session prep.

Seems to me you're in a similar place, at least around this question.

 

[Maxperson]

I'm not sure that homebrew worlds are that uncommon. Most estimates I've seen are that 30-50% of all campaigns are set in homebrew worlds.

The question is what does WotC consider to be homebrew? I run the Forgotten Realms, however, I never had a Spellplague or Sundering, King Azoun is still alive, and past games have modified my Forgotten Realms such that it is very different from one someone would purchase. Is that a homebrew world or not? A good argument could be made for both yes and no.