D&D General Playstyle vs Mechanics

[Oofta]

There are things within combat that automatically succeed though. You can automatically move your base rate to get into close quarters with someone, for example (barring some sort of legendary interrupt action I guess). You can draw your sword automatically. You can use action surge automatically. These things just don't resolve the actual fight.

Similarly, the background traits are pretty minor effects that mostly set up other rolls or negate minor obstacles. The local populace give you shelter - OK, what next? The underworld messengers send a message for you - OK, how is it received, what happens as a result? The hobgoblin court grants you an audience - OK, can you convince them to do what you want, or even not to eat you?

It's a false equivalence to say the effects of the background traits are like automatically winning a combat. These are minor, minor things.

Yes, there are rules for combat. But there are many cases where you can't do something you could normally achieve.

I'm not going to argue about infinite strawmen any more. The background features did not work for me and I didn't use them as written when I DMed. For that matter I never saw any DM allow them as written in any game I played either.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

People. Like them or not, the background traits worked under somewhat different logic than the rest of the game, so it is understandable that some people found them jarring. And WotC seemed to agree, given that they're gone in 5.5.

The horse is truly dead. WotC nuked it. I'm not sure there is much point in arguing about it anymore.

 

[TwoSix]

People. Like them or not, the background traits worked under somewhat different logic than the rest of the game, so it is understandable that some people found them jarring. And WotC seemed to agree, given that they're gone in 5.5.

The horse is truly dead. WotC nuked it. I'm not sure there is much point in arguing about it anymore.

When has that ever stopped us?

 

[hawkeyefan]

unbelievability

The idea that there are well connected people in your world is unbelievable? Okay.

The issue as I see it is that all that creativity you're suggesting comes with the restriction that it serve the principle that the mechanic in question must work as written; that is, that the fiction must bend to serve the mechanics. I find that principle uncomfortable personally, though I know others are fine with it.

The fiction bends all the time to serve the mechanics, and vice versa. There's a back and forth. When someone decides they're going to resort to violence, we then have all the participants roll initiative, and then that tells us who goes first, and so on.

The results of combat are never predetermined. The results of using a background feature are. You can add all the fluff you want, all the creative explanations in the world or none at all and as written the background feature still works.

What about something more in line with what we're talking about? Do you ever determine that a character who is proficient in the orc language doesn't understand something said in orc? Do you just allow that to work every time? Do you require a roll?

 

[mamba]

I haven't looked at the background in a while; isn't it just a person who's traveled extensively and has something like a worldwide contact list?

it says nothing about how they acquired the contact list, but yes, they know messengers that in turn know how to reach their actual contact everywhere

For a level 1 Rogue or Fighter or… anything, I find that hard to believe. It’s something else if your character is a Prince, Ironman or James Bond, those probably have an extensive contact list (that still falls short of ‘everywhere’ however)

 

[mamba]

The idea that there are well connected people in your world is unbelievable? Okay

no, the idea that your 1st level Rogue is one of them is

The fiction bends all the time to serve the mechanics, and vice versa.

cool, I am bending the mechanics here, should not be a problem then

 

[hawkeyefan]

People. Like them or not, the background traits worked under somewhat different logic than the rest of the game, so it is understandable that some people found them jarring. And WotC seemed to agree, given that they're gone in 5.5.

The horse is truly dead. WotC nuked it. I'm not sure there is much point in arguing about it anymore.

It's more about the overall idea of DMs relinquishing some creative control to the players or not. The background features just work as an easy example that was literally part of the game and not someone's home brewed version of allowing that kind of thing.

 

[Bae'zel]

People. Like them or not, the background traits worked under somewhat different logic than the rest of the game, so it is understandable that some people found them jarring. And WotC seemed to agree, given that they're gone in 5.5.

The horse is truly dead. WotC nuked it. I'm not sure there is much point in arguing about it anymore.

Yeah my approach has been to keep it simple and go with something that they did in the Baldur's Gate 3 game: dish out advantage to a PC's skill check when I feel that their Background, Class or Species would give them the upper hand.

Eg, the whole party does a Religion check to identify the god/goddess depicted in a mural. As a DM, I know that it is a Nature plant deity, so the Druid and the Fighter with the Farmer background both get advantage to the check.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Yeah my approach has been to keep it simple and go with something that they did in the Baldur's Gate 3 game: dish out advantage to a PC's skill check when I feel that their Background, Class or Species would give them the upper hand.

Eg, the whole party does a Religion check to identify the god/goddess depicted in a mural. As a DM, I know that it is a Nature plant deity, so the Druid and the Fighter with the Farmer background both get advantage to the check.

Yeah, I do the same. And "background" I use for this is not just the mechanical feature the player chose, but their whole backstory.

 

[hawkeyefan]

no, the idea that your 1st level Rogue is one of them is

Why? Are all first level characters in your game fresh off the farm? None of them have had any kind of lived experiences prior to the start of play?