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D&D 5E Aberrant Mind's Psionic Sorcery is officially the most powerful feature.


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Sabathius42

Bree-Yark
I figured out a character that can easily defeat your super sorcerer.

10th level cleric.
Race, stats, spells, feats unimportant.

In every situation
1. Wake up and pray to my diety (Divine Intervention) that whatever beast is running around melting peoples brains and dominating them seemingly undetectably gets Gated to my gods feet so that he can render justice to the foul devil stalking the streets.

10% chance daily you die (or are depowered and sent back if I have a nice god) and I can do it from anywhere on the planet. Not just me, but all my clericy brothers and sisters until your character disappears.
 

Hohige

Explorer
My mistake.

I agree.

Backgrounds from campaign setting you aren't playing in, casting 8th level spells with a 10th level character, endless double metamagicing all your spells, ruling that offensive casting can be done ignoring line of sight, ruling that offensive spell don't make you unhidden make this character AWESOME.

I couldn't disagree more.

1) Yes. I am casting Psionic Sorcery level 8 spells with 8 sorcery points. This is called Psionic Sorcery.

2) Endless Double Metamagicing?

Yes, because Psionic Sorcery is compatible with metamagic. Accept that man.

3) Ignoring Line of Sight?

1605792654165.png

You are completely wrong, no stealth rules say that you have no line of sight and stealth does not mean being paralysed behind a wall. It means a mixture of silently moving and hiding in a situational way.
Regarding line of sight, it seems that you are trying to create rules here.
Now, what will you do with a Subtle Greater Invisibility and Psionic Casting.


4) Casting offensive magic with Psionic Sorcery like Mind Spike, Spnatic Static, Dominate Person has no visible effect and yes, you are dead with no chance of reaction and It doesn't reveal his position or any evidence of spellcasting, can be casted on social encounter.
Another spell like Subtle Earth Eruption explodes without revealing its position, because unlike fireballs, the spell does not leave your hand until the target. It simply explodes in the chosen area.


You don't seem to understand how the rules work properly.
 
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Hohige

Explorer
Naw optional rules which are 100% "needs DM approval or else by default it's a no" have no place in optimization builds. It's accepted that feats, metamagic, and races listed in DnDBeyond are OK. But not the swapping for variant human custom lineage stuff. That's way out there DM approval level.
All on tasha's is optinal, including PHB's feats. DM's approval is always needed to everything <3
If your DM disallows Custom Lineage. Go V.Human. It's easy.
 

Hohige

Explorer
As far as I know you get TWO ASIs by level 10, not three [Edit: and Custom Lineage is "DM's Approval or else default it's not allows" and not OK for optimization builds]. Your first is at level 4, and your second is at level 8. Also, there is no such thing as "Fort" I think you mean Strength.




As far as I know, you get 3, not 6. Two at 3rd level, one more at 10th level.



Edit: How is Pass Without Trace on your spell list?



I think this is an optional rule?

As for you highlights, let's fix the problems you have first, and then look again.

1) Wrong. I have 3 ASI. Custom Lineage or V.Human.

2) I have 5 Metamagic Options, 3 for sorcerer class and 2 for Metamagic Adept feat

3) Pass without trace is from Dimir operative background.

4) So far there is nothing to fix.
 

Hohige

Explorer
I figured out a character that can easily defeat your super sorcerer.

10th level cleric.
Race, stats, spells, feats unimportant.

In every situation
1. Wake up and pray to my diety (Divine Intervention) that whatever beast is running around melting peoples brains and dominating them seemingly undetectably gets Gated to my gods feet so that he can render justice to the foul devil stalking the streets.

10% chance daily you die (or are depowered and sent back if I have a nice god) and I can do it from anywhere on the planet. Not just me, but all my clericy brothers and sisters until your character disappears.

"Please god (DM), this character is too strong, just kill him"
1605791044939.png

It's fun.
 

Mistwell

Legend
All on tasha's is optinal, including PHB's feats. DM's approval is always needed to everything <3
If your DM disallows Custom Lineage. Go V.Human. It's easy.
Naw man, this particular rule isn't the level of "optional" that feats are. It's up there with "how to make a house rule" territory. So make the build without that nonsense please so we can fairly evaluate it. Besides, "greatest ever" when weighed against past builds that never had access to this highly optional rule when they were written, and which have nothing to do with the Aberrant Mind subclass to begin with, makes it look like you're running from those other builds and cannot make this build without that bit of "cheating."
 

Hohige

Explorer
Naw man, this particular rule isn't the level of "optional" that feats are. It's up there with "how to make a house rule" territory. So make the build without that nonsense please so we can fairly evaluate it. Besides, "greatest ever" when weighed against past builds that never had access to this highly optional rule when they were written, and which have nothing to do with the Aberrant Mind subclass to begin with, makes it look like you're running from those other builds and cannot make this build without that bit of "cheating."
Custom Lineage is an amazing rule. Its not powercreep.
Wtf, Its +2 one atribute and a feat.
Its a way to customize your race to fit your theme.
For my Aberrant Mind Sorceror, The custom Lineage (shakar Kai) is amazing thematically.
Because Shadar Kai is too fantastic thematically.
Mechanically is equal to V.human race.


V.human instead Custom Lineage and nothing changes.
 
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Mistwell

Legend
Custom Lineage is an amazing rule. Its not powercreep.
Wtf, Its +2 one atribute and a feat.
Its a way to customize your race to fit your theme.
For my Aberrant Mind Sorceror, The custom Lineage (shakar Kai) is amazing thematically.
Because Shadar Kai is too fantastic thematically.
Mechanically is equal to V.human race.


V.human instead Custom Lineage and nothing changes.
There are certain conventions of char opt builds which are presented to the public for comment like this one. Since you've chosen to participate, you either follow those conventions or you lose out on the ability to have your creations compared and contrasted to other builds, and taken seriously as part of char opt libraries and authors.

There is power in being good at char opt. TreantMonk for example is making decent money, and has prestige, for having done it well for years and turned it into a successful Youtube channel, and a patreon.

You're pretty good at it, and will get better over time. But, you cannot succeed unless you're willing to work within those conventions.

One of them is you cannot use "highly optional, DM approval or else automatically no" type options. Feats and Multiclassing are considered acceptable because both are acceptable in AL so they've sort of fallen out of the "optional" category for charop despite being called out as optional. Point Buy and Standard Array are considered acceptable but rolling for stats is not due to the variability. Assuming magic items is generally considered not acceptable. Using rules specifically called out as optional rules of the nature of Custom Lineage is considered not acceptable. Using backgrounds from a specialty setting which don't conform to the standard format and elements of background (like the one which gives you tons of spells) are considered not acceptable. Even using more than Core +1 Supplementable books is sometimes considered not acceptable, and other times if it's acceptable it's done with a caveat that this might not be AL legal.

It's not that you cannot combine all these things against convention. It's just that you can't hope to be considered successful as a char oper unless you do.

So your choice. I think you have the bones of a really good build here worth developing further, within the conventions. If you think it cannot really hold up without those elements which go against the conventions, well that probably says it was never the subclass that was powerful but those other elements.

Personally, I hope you take another crack at it, because I am starting to enjoy your builds and I'd like to see more in the future from you.
 

Hohige

Explorer
There are certain conventions of char opt builds which are presented to the public for comment like this one. Since you've chosen to participate, you either follow those conventions or you lose out on the ability to have your creations compared and contrasted to other builds, and taken seriously as part of char opt libraries and authors.

There is power in being good at char opt. TreantMonk for example is making decent money, and has prestige, for having done it well for years and turned it into a successful Youtube channel, and a patreon.

You're pretty good at it, and will get better over time. But, you cannot succeed unless you're willing to work within those conventions.

One of them is you cannot use "highly optional, DM approval or else automatically no" type options. Feats and Multiclassing are considered acceptable because both are acceptable in AL so they've sort of fallen out of the "optional" category for charop despite being called out as optional. Point Buy and Standard Array are considered acceptable but rolling for stats is not due to the variability. Assuming magic items is generally considered not acceptable. Using rules specifically called out as optional rules of the nature of Custom Lineage is considered not acceptable. Using backgrounds from a specialty setting which don't conform to the standard format and elements of background (like the one which gives you tons of spells) are considered not acceptable. Even using more than Core +1 Supplementable books is sometimes considered not acceptable, and other times if it's acceptable it's done with a caveat that this might not be AL legal.

It's not that you cannot combine all these things against convention. It's just that you can't hope to be considered successful as a char oper unless you do.

So your choice. I think you have the bones of a really good build here worth developing further, within the conventions. If you think it cannot really hold up without those elements which go against the conventions, well that probably says it was never the subclass that was powerful but those other elements.

Personally, I hope you take another crack at it, because I am starting to enjoy your builds and I'd like to see more in the future from you.
WTF Man, The only "highly optional" is custom Lineage that isnt Power Creed and easily changeable for V.human.
The Power of The build is stealthy casting, metamagic, versatility and Mind controlling, Strong combos like Twin Polymorph, Mind Controling.
WTF are you saying about a Race with +2 one atribute and a feat?
I Will repeat again, +2 one atribute and a feat. Equal Power to V.human
Its pointless

The build is The strongest by a large margin stronger than any other.
That all
If you dislike It. Change The Custom Lineage for V.human!
Is It hard to undertand?
 

Sabathius42

Bree-Yark
You don't seem to understand how the rules work properly.
I'll just leave it at this and tap out.

At my table you would only be able to cast up to 5th level spells, regardless of slots or points.

At my table casting many of the spells in your build would render you no longer "stealthed". Enemies would know both that an enemy was around and where you were when you cast the spell.

At my table no build would ever allow a character to "win" D&D regardless of how things were worded or interpreted, much like the bag of rats from 5e.

I challenge you to revisit your own interpretations on the grey areas of this build and acknowledge that the fundamental power of it lies in your definitions of those portions of your character.
 

Mistwell

Legend
WTF Man, The only "highly optional" is custom Lineage that isnt Power Creed and easily changeable for V.human.
The Power of The build is stealthy casting, metamagic, versatility and Mind controlling, Strong combos like Twin Polymorph, Mind Controling.
WTF are you saying about a Race with +2 one atribute and a feat?
I Will repeat again, +2 one atribute and a feat. Equal Power to V.human
Its pointless

The build is The strongest by a large margin stronger than any other.
That all
If you dislike It. Change The Custom Lineage for V.human!
Is It hard to undertand?
OK, so you've decided you're not willing to accept common conventions for char opt. That's too bad, but it's your choice. Just, don't expect much feedback from people.
 


Mistwell

Legend
I accepted. V.human instead Custom Lineage.
the background

Oh hey I finally figured out how that thing works. These spells are considered added to your vanilla class spell list, but aren't automatically known.

Right. Let's see which level you learn which spell, and which level you swap which spell. I think we will find you don't get the list you put there, but we shall see.
 
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BacchusNL

Explorer
I'm confused. Does this dude think he can cast lvl 8 spells using 8 sorc points? Because I would pay good money to see a player try to make that case to a DM. That would be hillarious.
 


Mistwell

Legend
And when the book actually came out, the text with reference to the chart makes it super clear they mean the level you gain access to the spell. His argument on that, which was never a good one, became even weaker when you look at the real reference.
 

BacchusNL

Explorer
And when the book actually came out, the text with reference to the chart makes it super clear they mean the level you gain access to the spell. His argument on that, which was never a good one, became even weaker when you look at the real reference.
You are telling me that WotC doesn't let people cast spells they don't have the equivelant spell slots for? Shocker.

No...wait. That's one of the fundamental building blocks of 5E. My bad.
 

Mistwell

Legend
You are telling me that WotC doesn't let people cast spells they don't have the equivelant spell slots for? Shocker.

No...wait. That's one of the fundamental building blocks of 5E. My bad.
Yes, he's wrong. However, he's channeling the spirit of some great optimizers from the 3e and 4e era. You gotta try this stuff out and see if you can make it work.

Eventually you move on, but I think it's cool he tried a new exploit out and tested the concept as best he could. He's still fighting the battle after it's already lost, but who among us hasn't made that mistake?

Overall I have to say I like this thread. He's made me like the Aberrant Mind sorcerer, when before I didn't have much interest in it. This is cool stuff, reminiscent of the old WOTC optimization board.
 

Hohige

Explorer
1605900118426.png


A new combo unleash.

Distant Psionic Telekinesis (120ft range).
Well now we can subtle cast it and distant it. Can we now use our action to retrain the creatures into the air, disarming the enemy's weapons? NOTE: The optional Magical Guidance ability also applies here!
Your power is increase a lot with Magical Guidance.
You can do it, using a action and Psionic Quickened (Choose the spell as bonus action) as bonus action.
You also can do it with stealth casting.


Can it apply Twin?
 
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