D&D 5E Companion thread to 5E Survivor - Subclasses (Part XIV: Wizard)

[doctorbadwolf]

Mearls has said that if they could do the warlock again, they wouldn't make the distinction between Patron and Pact but create a singular subclass. They would make it less modular. This is why I am very curious about how they will design the One D&D warlock.

Luckily, Mearls isn’t on the team anymore, and hasn’t been for quite a while.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

One wizard subclass should just be "specialist".
Or every wizard should just chose a school at level 1 and chose a proper subclass later.
The spwcialiat option could expand on the school selection.

 

[Tonguez]

We do have the Celestial Warlock!

Yeah I’m constantly asking whats the difference between a cleric and a celestial warlocks patron, it seems they ought to be the same thing.
Anyway taking the fact that a Warlock has better damage output than an Evoker maybe

Warlock (War Mage) = Evocation, Abjuration
Scorcerer = Conjuration, Transmutation
Psion/Illusionist =Enchantment, Illusion
Necromancer
Divination (Sage?)

 

[Undrave]

I'm not working with some chump angel. I demand to speak to the manager!

At that point it's just fluff

 

[DND_Reborn]

Why is a warlock channeling divinity? They don’t serve a god. Hell, they don’t necessarily actually serve their patron, but even if they do it isn’t at all the same kind of relationship as a faith-worship relationship.

Channel Divinity is just a name. God grant power through worship, Patrons as a "deal" (which really is just a type of deal that clerics make: worship). The invocations last until you rest, and you can change them making them more versatile.

And there is nothing that points to the type and character of the patron at all, it’s just a word used in the fluff, with identical mechanics regardless.

Nope, it is all fluff.

So a wizard with meta magic. Yeah if that is enough for make a sorcerer for you, fine, though I think you’ve made a wildly overpowered wizard tradition, and probably homebrewed the base wizard a bit, since wizards get subclass at level 2.

Which is something they always should have had. It could have been their "thing" but since they made an entire new class for it...

And how is it any more "wildly overpowered" than what sorcerers already do?

I’m glad you’ve got homebrew that works for you.

Thanks. They do, and nicely.

 

[Undrave]

Divination (Sage?)

My home-brewed Warlock Patron, The Paradox, grants some Divination spells... take a look ;P

 

[Maxperson]

One wizard subclass should just be "specialist".
Or every wizard should just chose a school at level 1 and chose a proper subclass later.
The spwcialiat option could expand on the school selection.

I'd really love to see something like...

Choose a school to specialize in and then randomly lose two schools to use. Or if that's too harsh, choose two school to be unable to use. I like choices that have significant meaning.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Channel Divinity is just a name. God grant power through worship, Patrons as a "deal" (which really is just a type of deal that clerics make: worship).

This is the single worst aspect of the 5e warlock class design, a the biggest culprit in making the class not feel like the concept. It should be absolutely clear that the patron is not giving you the hex spell when you cast it, you gave or promised soemthing and they gave you the means to take the power you needed and do whatever the hell you want with it.

The fact that people seem to see warlocks as more subject to their patrons will than clerics to their gods is an egregious absurdity.

The invocations last until you rest, and you can change them making them more versatile.

Great, also not relevant to whether the subclass makes a character feel like a warlock, and certainly does nothing to address how much more powerful this is than other cleric subclasses.

Nope, it is all fluff.

Which is a weakness. It makes it so that the base class defines the character vastly more than the subclass, meaning you’re just playing a cleric.

If it being just fluff doesn’t matter, why even make a subclass for it? Just play any cleric and change the fluff.

Which is something they always should have had. It could have been their "thing" but since they made an entire new class for it...

Great, why call it a sorcerer? What’s it got to do with the actual themes and premise of the sorcerer?

And how is it any more "wildly overpowered" than what sorcerers already do?

It’s on top of what the wizard does. It’s a class and a half. The sorcerer isn’t exactly broken as written, but they are a strong class, and you’ve added half of their power to an already equally powerful or more powerful class.

 

[DND_Reborn]

This is the single worst aspect of the 5e warlock class design, a the biggest culprit in making the class not feel like the concept. It should be absolutely clear that the patron is not giving you the hex spell when you cast it, you gave or promised soemthing and they gave you the means to take the power you needed and do whatever the hell you want with it.

The fact that people seem to see warlocks as more subject to their patrons will than clerics to their gods is an egregious absurdity.

Yeah, no I agree with the bolded part, but if you aren't doing what you gave/promised, why is the Patron "powering" you. What? You have them "power you up" once and they leave it at that? What is the point of them "giving you power" if they have no way of ensuring you will do what they want... other than showing up and just killing the PC?

If it being just fluff doesn’t matter, why even make a subclass for it? Just play any cleric and change the fluff.

To keep the invocations, which IME is the only reason someone plays a warlock. The spells on a short rest is a nice second point, but not the major attraction.

Great, why call it a sorcerer? What’s it got to do with the actual themes and premise of the sorcerer?

Because it is the subclass that uses metamagic and none of the others do. What "theme or premise" are you even talking about?

 

[CleverNickName]

And we're down to the Top Five. They are, in descending order:
Abjuration > Enchantment > Conjuration > Divination > Transmutation