D&D 5E Count of 5e saves from MM and PHB by stat and class

[bleezy]

Strength saving throws are the least consequential to fail (most in the MM are save vs. get knocked prone by a goat or something), and Intelligence saving throws are the worst (Mind Flayer, Intellect Devourer, Feeblemind).

I think that fighter/barbarian have the most to gain from the Resilient feat. Once they have proficiency in Wisdom saves, they can avoid the worst common effects. Failing a Dex save usually entails taking a huge amount of damage, which fighters and barbarians can soak up with their large HP totals.

I would never take Resilient(Int) unless mind flayers were the major antagonists of the campaign, in which case I would certainly take it.

 

[clearstream]

It would be interesting to know if the trend is fairly consistent across CR's or if higher CR's favored 1 type of save and lower CR's favored others.

Yes, and I also wondered if instead of treating all spell saves as equal, there should be some weighting for either level or how bad they are to fail.

 

[Hussar]

And, let's be honest here, saves have NEVER been equal. In AD&D, there were a bajillion poison saves. Every monster and it's cousin had poison. But, a save vs Wand/Staff/Rod? Yeah, not going to come up all that often.

Even in 3e, there were far more Fort save effects, simply because so many common monsters had poison. It's a pretty standard "go to" effect for a lot of critters and, let's be honest here, it's a pretty easy thing to add as well. Need to beef up that orc encounter? Poof, they have weakly poisoned weapons that deal a bit of damage instead of save or die.

Now, with 3e's 3 saves, there probably was a bit more balance between them. Charm effects are pretty common, so, will saves are pretty necessary. Sure, there's probably some more fort saves in 3e, but, it's not like will was THAT far behind.

Thing is, an Int save is such a wonky thing. It's really hard to imagine an effect that hurts you because you are stupid. Wisdom is the go to generally for any sort of mental fortitude effect (and always has been). Same with Cha effects. What does a Cha effect actually look like? Hey, you're kinda good looking and personable, so that makes you better able to resist ... ummm .... well... hrm.

It's just kinda the nature of the game that Int and Cha saves aren't going to be used all that much. It's really hard to think of an effect that would be resisted by either stat.

 

[gyor]

I think it's funny that the Sorceror benefits from it's con save Prof more then Barbarians or Fighters, because except for Eldritch Knights, they don't need to worry about constration checks, but the Sorceror does.

 

[Horwath]

Now if we combine save to previous edition standards...

we get;

Fortitude save(str+con): 181

Reflex save(dex): 100

Will save(int+wis+cha): 115


Fort will be highest but most are poisons for more or less damage and positioning influence.


spread is much more balanced.

Each class would get one save proficiency.

 

[clearstream]

And, let's be honest here, saves have NEVER been equal. In AD&D, there were a bajillion poison saves. Every monster and it's cousin had poison. But, a save vs Wand/Staff/Rod? Yeah, not going to come up all that often.

Even in 3e, there were far more Fort save effects, simply because so many common monsters had poison. It's a pretty standard "go to" effect for a lot of critters and, let's be honest here, it's a pretty easy thing to add as well. Need to beef up that orc encounter? Poof, they have weakly poisoned weapons that deal a bit of damage instead of save or die.

Now, with 3e's 3 saves, there probably was a bit more balance between them. Charm effects are pretty common, so, will saves are pretty necessary. Sure, there's probably some more fort saves in 3e, but, it's not like will was THAT far behind.

Thing is, an Int save is such a wonky thing. It's really hard to imagine an effect that hurts you because you are stupid. Wisdom is the go to generally for any sort of mental fortitude effect (and always has been). Same with Cha effects. What does a Cha effect actually look like? Hey, you're kinda good looking and personable, so that makes you better able to resist ... ummm .... well... hrm.

It's just kinda the nature of the game that Int and Cha saves aren't going to be used all that much. It's really hard to think of an effect that would be resisted by either stat.

From the PHB

Strength, measuring physical power
Dexterity, measuring agility
Constitution, measuring endurance
Intelligence, measuring reasoning and memory
Wisdom, measuring perception and insight
Charisma, measuring force of personality

 

[Krachek]

Basically that intelligence and charisma saves are very rare. That doesn't mean that they are bad as they may protect you against some very potent stuff. It doesn't mean they will be very rare in every game either. However, it does mean that if I'm going into a campaign without any other info then I'm not going to prioritize intelligence or charisma ones ever.

Present like that these numbers look like a monthly Meta analysis of a card game.
The orc with poisoned club is a popular deck, make sure to be able to counter it.

 

[Eltab]

I don't know about you, but if a demon is trying to suck my Paladin into a portal to the Abyss (so he can beat the stuffing out of me on his home turf), I'm going to be GLAD I've got a good CHR Save to resist the reverse-Banishment.

Which returns us to a question asked earlier:
What do the various Saves protect you from, and
How out-of-the-fight are you if you take the full effect of -whatever it was- ?

 

[Wiseblood]

What useful conclusions can we make using these numbers?

That the Ranger failed his save and died so he doesn't count.

 

[Krachek]

That the Ranger failed his save and died so he doesn't count.

We could guess that it was a Con saving throw!