D&D 5E [D&D 5e] Planescape- In Through the Out Door (Full)

[Shayuri]

Bad. Ass.

 

[Pembinasa]

I for one am good with just about all of this. A find familiar spell that turns his spellbook into a floating papery head full of ancient knowledge? That's just all kinds of uniquely awesome!

That said, my biggest concern is Graydon sending his spellbook off to pick fights with people all the time; putting the source of a wizard's magic on the frontline seems a pretty risky proposition under any circumstances. What happens when Shandrizar winds up losing a fight? He goes comatose, and Graydon can't prepare any more spells because all the arcane equations he needs to impress upon mind and soul have been riddled with stab-holes.

I'm still thoroughly interested in working with this idea, but you can bet that Graydon's 4th-level cantrip choice will be Mending.

 

[Shayuri]

Well, healing spells should work on him just fine.

And I believe that he's usable as a spellbook even while 'dead.'

So Graydon should be okay...

He could always use another spellbook later, if it becomes a problem, and just copy spells from the sentient one. Much to that book's annoyance I imagine.

 

[Pembinasa]

Whether I want it to become a problem or not, I think it legitimately should be a problem; a book that's going up against somebody with a greatsword and loses really shouldn't be legible anymore. And while I'd qualify a sapient book as the equivalent of an Awakened construct, if [MENTION=6781406]Unsung[/MENTION] says healing spells will do the job then I daresay healing spells will do the job.

I'm just thinking this is going to be quite the enjoyable nuisance for Graydon, and I don't doubt it'll be worth it!

 

[Unsung]

@Quickleaf Great work, as expected. I don't see anything that would prevent you from joining the party right now, and I can think of a few ways to hook Shandrizar into the plot going forward. I do think you could stand to be a little tougher for a tank, so I will still put an offer for some added durability options on the table. Exact details still to be determined, but I didn't want to hold off on posting

@Pembinasa Well, if you and Quickleaf don't *want* healing spells to work, then they don't have to. Discovering the secret of higher-tier repair spells (like the ones from Eberron) could be a quest unto itself, though I daresay a spell like fabricate could be made fit to purpose.

If we want to allow cure wounds and similar spells to deal positive energy (radiant) damage to undead, I wouldn't say no to that either. Though whether or not our resident effigy actually qualifies as that particular kind of undead is yet another matter.

If we're going to nitpick at D&D rules in-character, I say Planescape's as good a forum as any, and better than some.

 

[Quickleaf]

I for one am good with just about all of this. A find familiar spell that turns his spellbook into a floating papery head full of ancient knowledge? That's just all kinds of uniquely awesome!

That said, my biggest concern is Graydon sending his spellbook off to pick fights with people all the time; putting the source of a wizard's magic on the frontline seems a pretty risky proposition under any circumstances. What happens when Shandrizar winds up losing a fight? He goes comatose, and Graydon can't prepare any more spells because all the arcane equations he needs to impress upon mind and soul have been riddled with stab-holes.

I'm still thoroughly interested in working with this idea, but you can bet that Graydon's 4th-level cantrip choice will be Mending.

Cool, glad the dialogue was fruitful and the character works for you!

Well, there is the versilimitude question about what happens when a Spellbook is stabbed, chopped, and burnt? How much is legibile after that? Personally, it's a question I think we can mostly side step because HP are abstract for characters already. If we need to narrate the damage physically, it can be damage to the cover which is made of the hide of some mystical beast, rather than the interior pages. I imagine we can handle corner case scenarios (e.g. submersion) as they crop up.

Well, healing spells should work on him just fine.

And I believe that he's usable as a spellbook even while 'dead.'

So Graydon should be okay...

He could always use another spellbook later, if it becomes a problem, and just copy spells from the sentient one. Much to that book's annoyance I imagine.

Yeah, the idea is if Shandrizar gets reduced to 0 HP he is out of the fight until Summon Familiar is cast. On the downside, that means no healing spells can bring him back from "unconscious", and he won't naturally recover from that state. On the plus side, a level 1 spell - Summon Familiar - effectively operates like Raise Dead on him (or actually better than Raise Dead cause there's no time limit for Summon Familiar).

And yes, the diminished archmage would be insulted if Graydon took on a second "traveling" Spellbook, and would certainly deride the book on its inferiority even if it were a one-sided conversation.

[MENTION=20323]Quickleaf[/MENTION] Great work, as expected. I don't see anything that would prevent you from joining the party right now, and I can think of a few ways to hook Shandrizar into the plot going forward. I do think you could stand to be a little tougher for a tank, so I will still put an offer for some added durability options on the table. Exact details still to be determined, but I didn't want to hold off on posting

Thanks Yeah, I think it makes sense for me to begin posting in the IC thread when Graydon consults his Spellbook, the group takes a short rest, or they visit a library, or something along those lines. Hmm, let me read the last couple posts and see if the timing is right.

EDIT: I left the backstory open-ended for DM mischief, but I am happy to provide further details if needed / desired.

As for durability (AC & HP), his HP 27 is about on par with a level 3 fighter with CON 14, and his AC 15 is on par with a fighter wearing a chain shirt & shield/Dex 14, or half plate & Dex 10. So perhaps his AC is lagging a little, but on the other hand he can deal 15 damage on his turn, which is on par with a level 3 fighter with DEX 18 dual-wielding scimitars. Hmm. If you want to give him a +1 AC bonus, I am cool with that, though I am not sure it is necessary, especially since it only takes a 1st level spell to revive him (not to mention Second Wind). IMO The real boost in frontline effectiveness comes when you take the Sentinel feat.

[MENTION=6776473]Pembinasa[/MENTION] Well, if you and [MENTION=20323]Quickleaf[/MENTION] don't *want* healing spells to work, then they don't have to. Discovering the secret of higher-tier repair spells (like the ones from Eberron) could be a quest unto itself, though I daresay a spell like fabricate could be made fit to purpose.

Yeah, cure wounds & healing word both say they don't work on constructs or undead. I guess if I'm benefiting from other construct traits like not needing to eat, drink, breathe, or sleep, then it's only fair that I be treated as a construct for the purpose of these spells too. If that's the approach we take, then that extra +1 AC you offered sounds a lot more enticing

Another idea, to rip off Planescape: Torment, are unique healing methods that can only be used by certain characters. For example, maybe spell scrolls can be consumed to heal Shandrizar, or maybe a visit to a local bookbinder replaces the clerical services usually offered at a temple, or maybe certain rare components (inks, powders, gilding) could be used as a healing kit on him. Just a thought.

Similar idea could apply to Picayune, the effigy.

 

[Pembinasa]

I had actually wanted to bring up something rather similar, actually; would customizing the spellbook (iron plates for covers, specially-crafted combat bookmark, hell why not slip shuriken between the pages) qualify as equipment for Shandrizar? Also, if Graydon ever manages to inscribe sepia snake sigil in there, could Shandy start spitting serpents? I dearly love the idea of a book that can read itself, but I think text-based spells would be a sensible limitation to that... and I wouldn't want to try any 5e variations on explosive runes for obvious reasons.

 

[Shayuri]

I was going to say...5th Ed is much lighter on the equipment spiral than previous editions, but we WILL upgrade our gear as we proceed. If he's going to contribute to combat, our bookish friend will need a way to do the same, even if an unconventional way.

 

[Unsung]

Well, there is the versilimitude question about what happens when a Spellbook is stabbed, chopped, and burnt? How much is legibile after that? Personally, it's a question I think we can mostly side step because HP are abstract for characters already. If we need to narrate the damage physically, it can be damage to the cover which is made of the hide of some mystical beast, rather than the interior pages. I imagine we can handle corner case scenarios (e.g. submersion) as they crop up.

Yeah, the idea is if Shandrizar gets reduced to 0 HP he is out of the fight until Summon Familiar is cast. On the downside, that means no healing spells can bring him back from "unconscious", and he won't naturally recover from that state. On the plus side, a level 1 spell - Summon Familiar - effectively operates like Raise Dead on him (or actually better than Raise Dead cause there's no time limit for Summon Familiar).

I think this is another good limitation with a built-in benefit. Easy to resuscitate, difficult to repair or replace.

A magical book once possessed by (ha-ha) a planewalking archmage seems likely to have a few enchantments to increase its resiliency in the face of an adventuring lifestyle. Magic writing, too, may be able to retain its power even after the inks and parchment on which they were written should have long since crumbled. It's probably something to do with the power of the mage penning the spells.

And yes, the diminished archmage would be insulted if Graydon took on a second "traveling" Spellbook, and would certainly deride the book on its inferiority even if it were a one-sided conversation.

Thanks Yeah, I think it makes sense for me to begin posting in the IC thread when Graydon consults his Spellbook, the group takes a short rest, or they visit a library, or something along those lines. Hmm, let me read the last couple posts and see if the timing is right.

EDIT: I left the backstory open-ended for DM mischief, but I am happy to provide further details if needed / desired.

So would this be Graydon's spellbook that he had with him in Glantri? Or is it something he happened across (or is still yet to come across) in Sigil? Open question, to [MENTION=6776473]Pembinasa[/MENTION] and [MENTION=20323]Quickleaf[/MENTION]. Would Shandrizar be a great mage of Mystara, and if so, how much of his legend would Graydon know from his history lessons at the Great School?

Quickleaf, if you had some seeds for ideas of Shandrizar's legacy on the planes, would you mind hitting me with a PM of those when you've got the chance? Not because it's a secret, but because it should be a surprise.

As for durability (AC & HP), his HP 27 is about on par with a level 3 fighter with CON 14, and his AC 15 is on par with a fighter wearing a chain shirt & shield/Dex 14, or half plate & Dex 10. So perhaps his AC is lagging a little, but on the other hand he can deal 15 damage on his turn, which is on par with a level 3 fighter with DEX 18 dual-wielding scimitars. Hmm. If you want to give him a +1 AC bonus, I am cool with that, though I am not sure it is necessary, especially since it only takes a 1st level spell to revive him (not to mention Second Wind). IMO The real boost in frontline effectiveness comes when you take the Sentinel feat.

Yeah, cure wounds & healing word both say they don't work on constructs or undead. I guess if I'm benefiting from other construct traits like not needing to eat, drink, breathe, or sleep, then it's only fair that I be treated as a construct for the purpose of these spells too. If that's the approach we take, then that extra +1 AC you offered sounds a lot more enticing

Another idea, to rip off Planescape: Torment, are unique healing methods that can only be used by certain characters. For example, maybe spell scrolls can be consumed to heal Shandrizar, or maybe a visit to a local bookbinder replaces the clerical services usually offered at a temple, or maybe certain rare components (inks, powders, gilding) could be used as a healing kit on him. Just a thought.

Similar idea could apply to Picayune, the effigy.

It certainly could. Bookbinding is probably a tool proficiency worth looking into. Just saying.

If you're up for it, I'm inclined to say healing magic doesn't work on you, but mending and similar effects can. You don't heal with rest, but like with any inanimate object, repairs can be rushed. Unlike your organic inferiors, who only time (or divine magic) can help.

Some other construct immunities could apply: full immunity to poison, disease, paralysis. Maybe resistance to bludgeoning damage and/or piercing, with a vulnerability to fire. No need to eat, sleep, drink, or breathe, but subject to water damage as if drowning.

Suggestions welcomed-- there's quite a wealth of homebrewing experience at this particular table, I think, so it'd be a shame not to put it to work.

 

[Shayuri]

Maybe take a peek at the warforged rules?

 

[Unsung]

I was going to say...5th Ed is much lighter on the equipment spiral than previous editions, but we WILL upgrade our gear as we proceed. If he's going to contribute to combat, our bookish friend will need a way to do the same, even if an unconventional way.

I think what [MENTION=6776473]Pembinasa[/MENTION] was saying would make sense. Bookmarks, new binding, illuminations, filthy limericks scrawled in the margins, all of these could serve to modify and 'improve' Shandrizar the way normal equipment works for all you humanoid types.

 

[Quickleaf]

So would this be Graydon's spellbook that he had with him in Glantri? Or is it something he happened across (or is still yet to come across) in Sigil? Open question, to [MENTION=6776473]Pembinasa[/MENTION] and [MENTION=20323]Quickleaf[/MENTION]. Would Shandrizar be a great mage of Mystara, and if so, how much of his legend would Graydon know from his history lessons at the Great School?

Obviously this involves two of us players, but I was thinking that it was Graydon's original spell book "possessed" by Shandrizar...so Shandrizar can make notations, criticisms, and even new spells appear within it (at the DM's discretion of course), not to mention make it move and do his bidding like a body. However, I am open to other ideas.

I was thinking of Shandrizar as plane walking archmage who is a friend to the d'Ambrevilles who have a family member as headmaster of the Great School. There are several planar gates on Mystara and references to high level mages traversing other dimensions abound.

Quickleaf, if you had some seeds for ideas of Shandrizar's legacy on the planes, would you mind hitting me with a PM of those when you've got the chance? Not because it's a secret, but because it should be a surprise.

Sure thing!

If you're up for it, I'm inclined to say healing magic doesn't work on you, but mending and similar effects can. You don't heal with rest, but like with any inanimate object, repairs can be rushed. Unlike your organic inferiors, who only time (or divine magic) can help.

Interesting. Yeah, that works for me.

Some other construct immunities could apply: full immunity to poison, disease, paralysis. Maybe resistance to bludgeoning damage and/or piercing, with a vulnerability to fire. No need to eat, sleep, drink, or breathe, but subject to water damage as if drowning.

Hmm...if I adopt those then I'd probably need to swap out some racial features (maybe Gnome's Cunning) to make it fair, since those are potent. Always-on Resistance to bludgeoning and/or piercing damage is probably too powerful for a PC until much higher levels.

Maybe take a peek at the warforged rules?

Where might those be? In the MM?

 

[Quickleaf]

Also, [MENTION=6776473]Pembinasa[/MENTION] some cool things I didn't realize having a familiar let's you do:

1. Telepathy 100-ft with each other.

2. You can perceive thru my senses (darkvision) if I'm within 100-ft as an action.

3. I can deliver touch spells that you cast if you so desire, using my reaction, provided I'm within 100-ft of you.

The part about you being able to dismiss me at will is less cool (for me)

 

[Unsung]

Right here: http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/unearthed-arcana-eberron

Some good stuff here. The race options are functional, but honestly I'm happier to play it a little looser, especially with this particular game.

 

[Pembinasa]

I was thinking of Shandrizar as plane walking archmage who is a friend to the d'Ambrevilles who have a family member as headmaster of the Great School. There are several planar gates on Mystara and references to high level mages traversing other dimensions abound.

Aww, and here I was having fun with Mystara being so little-known out here- even if the Inner Planes would prove a much more fruitful place to find Mystaran knowledge. (Honor Island in Ierendi being an excellent example in that regard.) Given that OD&D's cosmology with all the Spheres didn't really mesh with the Great Wheel and it didn't really get hauled in with the rest until the Mystaraspace addition to Spelljammer, we'd been planning on having it be kind of a distant backwater place to the planars... but hey, that doesn't interfere with having a bunch of powerful wizards from there, when you think about it.

I could work with Shandizar knowing Mystara through whichever of the big families you had in mind, although do realize that claiming friendship with the scandalous d'Ambreville family isn't exactly a way for him to get trusted. Graydon's HEARD things about what the Headmaster's relatives get up to!

I think what @Pembinasa was saying would make sense. Bookmarks, new binding, illuminations, filthy limericks scrawled in the margins, all of these could serve to modify and 'improve' Shandrizar the way normal equipment works for all you humanoid types.

"There once was a mage from Nantu'khet..."

 

[CanadienneBacon]

You guys sound like you might could benefit from a looksie at the race building rules in the Pathfinder Advanced Race Guide. I'm fresh off of building a PC with a unique race using these rules and found some great suggestions and mechanics in there. The Advanced Race Guide is part of the Pathfinder SRD, so it's freely accessible online, too.

Lots of wonderful things going on in this thread.

 

[goatunit]

On the subject of sentient books, I believe there's a library on the Outlands that contains every book that was never written. They're pretty strict about their tomes getting out into the multiverse, but I figured it might be a useful detail for you to take advantage of.

 

[Unsung]

On the subject of sentient books, I believe there's a library on the Outlands that contains every book that was never written. They're pretty strict about their tomes getting out into the multiverse, but I figured it might be a useful detail for you to take advantage of.

No kiddin'? How 'bout that? That might be worth remembering, people.

 

[Shayuri]

Any chance Shard might make a perception check to hear what that guy called after her?

 

[CanadienneBacon]

Work. Ugh. Busy.

My smartphone has been forwarding a ton of notifications for activity for both our threads for this game (how fun!), but I'm unable to post anything substantive until this evening. [MENTION=6781406]Unsung[/MENTION], please rp as if Picayune is there and paying attention, but is merely picking his moment to act. --Wendy.