Is Aegis of Assault the worst mark?

I would say the weakness of all swordmages (and paladins, for that matter) is that they only mark one target with their marking power. This changes at Paragon (when you get Double Aegis), but until then the swordmage has to use his other powers to keep a second target occupied. For that reason, I like Lightning Lure in the Heroic tier. Being able to pull a foe away from an ally and towards you can really help with your primary role.

Swordmages work really well when teamed with Sorcerers - both have Close Blast and/or Close Burst powers (Sword Burst, Flame Cyclone, etc). It gets better at Paragon, especially with Shielding Swordmages. The sorcerer can either get temp HP or do damage at melee range when using an at-will power, and the Aegis of Defense can reduce damage while the sorcerer uses powers like Chaos Bolt (with Sorcerous Blade Channeling) or Burning Spray to hit multiple foes. The sorcerer is much more likely to trigger the mark because of the damage he's dishing out, and the Aegis of Defense reduces the damage before temp HP are applied.
 

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Would you mind posting how one of those type of combats went down? Lower level if possible. We're currently 3rd level, so higher level tactics are fun to read about, but not as useful.

As I see it, having a defender "run to the back of the enmy lines" sounds like a recipe for trouble. I'd love to be proved wrong.

Well, I can't do much good with lower level fights since I just started playing the character at level 7, but here are a few examples:

1) In a large area, we face a controller, a large elite soldier and a pair of smaller elite brutes.

Our fighter and cha-rogue engage the soldier and brutes while the warlord knights moves me into the room. On my turn, I move to the flank and charge the controller so I'm on his side, using Foesnare to hold him in place. On the next turn, I mark him and stay away from the party so he can't catch them and me at the same time. Meanwhile, the fighter, rogue and warlord keep the other monsters in melee while the laser cleric and wizard support from our back rank shooting at the controller or the main melee target depending on what's their best shot. It takes me several rounds to kill the monster controller, but he is never able to get the whole party with an AoE attack without getting smacked around.


2) In a icy area, we face a teleporting controller (or artillery, I can't tell) a few solders and a bunch of minions.

I use Promise of Storms and then Lightning Strider to teleport to (and attack) the controller while hitting some other enemies along the way. I then mark him. The rest of the part fights and easily defeats their front line. Their controller/artillery keeps teleporting away from me, but the mark means that if takes a hit penalty and gives me a free shot if he attacks the main party.


3) In a area with dangerous terrain, we face a mixture of soldiers, skirmisher and brutes along with a howling hag.

When the hag shows up, I Aumanthor's Step to behind her, mark her and hit her with Foesnare. She teleports, howls and >bamf< I hit her again. The next turn, I Transposing Lunge her into the damaging terrain. The rest of the party fights the rest of the battle...


I could go on... In fights where there is a vulnerable enemy backline, you can often force their backline into ineffective single-target melee attacks. In other fights, you need a front-line defender and a swordmage is adequate (not great - but adequate) for that task. Against solos, the fighter and I usually flank it and keep it in one place while everyone pounds on it like the hp-sack it is. If another party member gets surrounded by skirmishers, I use Dimensional Warp to switch places and then hit them with an Electrified Lash (and Promise of Storms). And, my favorite tactic is to use Transposing Lunge or Lightning Lure to drag monsters into dangerous terrain.

In short, Swordmages are very "controllery" defenders. They aren't as good as fighters at holding a line, but that's the ultimate specialty of fighters! No class beats a fighter in that sub-role. Where swordmages shine is in disrupting the enemy. Swordmages who teleport or charge-and-immobilize prevent the monster soldiers from doing their job. They are also good at using terrain and extracting other PCs from trouble. In this party, I think I have the second lowest damage output (the elf laser-cleric does even less damage, but is also a fantastic supporting piece), but our GM still complains that my swordmage is the most dangerous PC because the character has a huge disruptive impact on his plans.

-KS
 

Apropos of almost nothing, has anyone tried out a glaive swordmage yet?

I don't think the glaive is that strong a weapon, but maybe this could be a place for it.

-O
 

Defending your own squishies is your fighter's job.
(snip)
We do have a fighter as well tho, so we can split our defenders.
Right. I see a pattern here: swordmages are good if there's another defender in the party! :D

Well, I can't do much good with lower level fights since I just started playing the character at level 7, but here are a few examples:
Thanks! It's very cool of you to type that up.

It's clear our swordmage needs to be pointed at these posts! So far the swordmage has been up against brutes, skirmishers, and soldiers...and all of your examples are controllers, etc. I'm becoming convinced of the strategy of "the swordmage in the defender's backfield...*if* there is a fighter in the frontlines".

Thanks again. Any others with experience in this?
 

The problem with the Assault Swordmage is that I don't see how they can work properly without another defender in the group.

But if the group already has a defender and is looking for someone to mess up the enemy backfield, then there are a number of other options that can have a similar impact. An archery ranger can be shooting those guys from range while Disrupting their attacks, for example.
 

Right. I see a pattern here: swordmages are good if there's another defender in the party! :D

First, I'll note that I play an assault swordmage. My suspicion is that a shielding swordmage is a better front-line defender.

Second, an assault swordmage shows the flexibility and limitation of the roles system. In terms of his function in the party, I think an assault swordmage is only barely on the defender side of the defender-controller spectrum. There is probably enough "defender" there for a three-character party. It is also a workable character if the rest of the party doesn't need as much defending (e.g. staff-wizards, melee clerics, str-rogues, etc...).

(As an aside, playing the secondary defender / backfield disruptor is *amazingly fun*.)

But, yes, for larger parties, a swordmage is better suited for the "secondary defender" role than the "primary defender" role. In that way, an assault swordmage is probably analogous to, for example, a paladin that is multi-classed into warlord or a melee cleric with fighter multi-class. I haven't played with any of the PH2 classes yes, but it wouldn't surprise me if some of them have a certain hybrid-role feel to them. As someone noted up-thread, a defense-focused avenger can probably "control/defend" the enemy backfield in a similar way to how I do it with a swordmage.

-KS
 

The problem with the Assault Swordmage is that I don't see how they can work properly without another defender in the group.

An Assault Swordmage group should work as well or better than a group that has zero defenders. ;)

Our group has an Assault Swordmage, a Cleric, an Invoker, a Rogue, and a Ranger. The AS has the highest AC (20 or 21 IIRC). The Cleric and Ranger both have reasonably high ACs (19 at level 2) and can handle being targets of melee attacks.

The Rogue and Invoker are our squishes and the Invoker (AC 18) hangs back whereas the Rogue (AC 16) goes up to flank and gets beat on. So, the AS typically concentrates his mark on a foe near the Rogue.
 

(As an aside, playing the secondary defender / backfield disruptor is *amazingly fun*.)

But, yes, for larger parties, a swordmage is better suited for the "secondary defender" role than the "primary defender" role.
That settles it: I'm emailing our swordmage this thread location.

My BRV hammer-n-shield fighter is reasonably good at being a "frontline meatshield", protecting our squishy wizard and ranger. ...But he sucks against ranged attacks form the Bad Guy controller. Putting our swordmage back there would help out my fighter, as well as protect the rest of the party from those nasty AoEs the controller/artillery puts down.

This should be our S.O.P.
 

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