D&D (2024) Martial vs Caster: Removing the "Magical Dependencies" of high level.

[MichaelSomething]

• High tier Martials can have class design space to CHOOSE a magic item.

It is a bit iffy to explain HOW nonmagical characters can guarantee a magic item. Maybe call it "fate"? Maybe the magic item somehow finds them, for some guaranteed reason? The explanations needs work to sound plausible for a nonmagical character.

But in principle, it is ok for a Martial to do powerful magic, by means of a magic item.


I also think this is why, making "spells" and "rituals" two different design spaces, and allowing Martials to try perform rituals solves many qualitative differences between Martials and full casters.

That's what downtime activities are for.

 

[James Gasik]

I think ultimately I have this question: If it did not replace the standard fighter, would you who are fans of the standard fighter object to a numerically-balanced mythic fighter being added to the game?

Likely yes, and I use as my evidence the Tome of Battle. It came out, giving us warriors with abilities scaled to be competitive (not equal to) with what a spellcaster can do, but with the warrior trope of "he can do this all day" fully intact.

Not only was the book rejected on the grounds of committing the sin of "not being D&D" (I'm being charitable, go to d4chan to find examples of more typical reactions), but it was extra vilified for, instead of fixing the Fighter, completely replacing the class with the Warblade.

 

[Yaarel]

I think ultimately I have this question: If it did not replace the standard fighter, would you who are fans of the standard fighter object to a numerically-balanced mythic fighter being added to the game?

If it didnt replace the Fighter, would fans object to a mythic Fighter?

Heh, we saw the Warlord. I think we know the answer.

 

[W'rkncacnter]

I mean D&D fighters take fireballs and dodge them without moving.

i mean...literally any DND character can. it's not even fighters that can negate them completely, but rogues and monks.

 

[Minigiant]

i mean...literally any DND character can. it's not even fighters that can negate them completely, but rogues and monks.

Yeah but the martials are the ones who are expected to fail the save but still survive.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I think ultimately I have this question: If it did not replace the standard fighter, would you who are fans of the standard fighter object to a numerically-balanced mythic fighter being added to the game?

Do you think there's any chance of WotC making  two fighters?

 

[Incenjucar]

Do you think there's any chance of WotC making  two fighters?

They have like six wizards, so no.

 

[W'rkncacnter]

(I'm being charitable, go to d4chan to find examples of more typical reactions)

also, god DAMN you for sending me down the 1d4chan rabbit hole again. i'm not gonna be out of this until i go to bed tonight.

 

[Hussar]

Well, really, giving magic “items” is more or less the way it works now. Instead of items though, we just make everyone a caster.

Look, I get the frustration. I share it. But after ten years, maybe it’s time to just accept that DnD is caster heavy. They’re not going to walk this back.

My prediction is that purely martial classes and subclasses will just become smaller and smaller niche choices as time goes on.

Nobody seems to want to play them. Every new character I see is a caster at least to some degree.

I give out free feats at first level and things like fae touched or ritual caster are practically the default choice.

IME purely martial characters are going the way of the dodo.

And I think it’s a real shame.

 

[W'rkncacnter]

Nobody seems to want to play them. Every new character I see is a caster at least to some degree.

I give out free feats at first level and things like fae touched or ritual caster are practically the default choice.

IME purely martial characters are going the way of the dodo.

yeah...because martials in 5e suck. it's not that people don't want to play martials - they DO. i'm in a pathfinder 2e group with a couple of 5e mains (though we met over 4e - most of the party ended up not liking it much) and of the 2, one is playing a magus and vastly prefers the martial aspects of it, and the other has bounced between FOUR DIFFERENT PURE MARTIALS since the game started - not out of a dislike for them (well, okay, out of a bit of a dislike for investigator), but out of excitement from the DISCOVERY OF A DIFFERENT MARTIAL CLASS.

the problem (at least from what i can see) isn't thematic - it's mechanical.