NEW Immortals Handbook - Ascension thread

[Pssthpok]

+(3:1), x7 on a crit = 21:1 on an 18-20 with a greataxe, and there ya go.
It just seems that, for no penalty to the attack roll that's a helluva lot of bonus damage; furthermore, I don't think DevCrit is an applicable counter to this point since you suggest replacing DevCrit with either your Multiplier feats or the metamartial death blow (the specific name escapes me).

Please consider the numbers, since it looks like it's a bit out of whack from where I'm standing.

 

[Ltheb Silverfrond]

Hmmm. This is interesting. A character hitting a foe, and exceeding their AC by 5, gets +105 to damage if they crit. Now, Suposedly this can be done in the mid-20's. The average hitpoints of a monster With a CR ~ 25 is between 200-1000. Weapon damage (including virtual size), strength mod, and magical weapons aside, this amount of damage is pretty fair.

Compare to level 1. A crit will deal, at max, 8(Dagger, no strength mod) to 52 (Scythe, +5 strength mod) damage. A foe a level 1 character will face has between 4 and 50 hit points.

Either way, crits will end the combat quickly. However, the low level character is more likely to auto-kill their foe: The epic level foes have inflated hitpoints and special defenses that do deflate the usefulness of melee combat. Damage Reduction, Regeneration, Nasty Armor class, and other special defenses can quickly phase out the effectiveness of a barbarian or a fighter useing crit-cheese.
Example: Fighter vs "Epic troll". The fighter might deal 8000 damage to the poor troll, but, barring special rules for de-atomization, if he doesn't have any means of dealing fire or acid damage, he can never kill it. Beat it into a 50 year coma maybe, but he can't actually finish it off. And if the "troll" is immune to unconsciousness (Magic item, spell, etc), that fighter can't hope to win.

Virtual size categories do level the playing field for fighters, but this feat combo is pretty good stand-alone. I think it really gets out of control with both.

 

[dante58701]

Thats why you burn the troll's body after it's been knocked unconscious.

On another note...

I'm still slightly confused about how many divine ability slots a deity gets in exchange for each artifact.

Strictly by the rules...how many divine ability slots would a hero-deity get for each artifact it doesn't have?

The reason I ask is because I noted that an St. Cuthbert gets 2 Cosmic abilities in exchange for 1 artifact. This seems to contradict the formula in Ascension.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi dante mate!

I'm still slightly confused about how many divine ability slots a deity gets in exchange for each artifact.

Strictly by the rules...how many divine ability slots would a hero-deity get for each artifact it doesn't have?

The reason I ask is because I noted that an St. Cuthbert gets 2 Cosmic abilities in exchange for 1 artifact. This seems to contradict the formula in Ascension.

Technically each artifact should be worth an amount of Divine Abilities equal to the immortal's divine rank.

However, I did previously proffer the idea that it should be:

Disciple-Quasi = swop one artifact for 1 divine ability
Demi-Greater = swop one artifact for 1 cosmic ability
Elder-First = swop one artifact for 1 transcendental ability
etc.

But I can just see people cheating round that and giving themselves artifacts with the full amount of divine abilities, so its probably not a workable option.

 

[dante58701]

So then I havent been giving my deities the divine artifact they deserve....

Thankyou for clearing the up for me. Now I wont be grasping for divine ability slots so hard.

This makes things a lot easier for me to have far more detailed deities.

Don't get me wrong, I don't like have a massive amount of esoteric abilities, I just like having multi-capable deities, with a lot of abilities to choose from in a pinch.

My DM is particularly cruel and likes to pound mere hero-deities with abominations.

As for flexibility by trading these abilities for divine ability slots. I like that because I play a lot of monks and a lot of carnifex (unique class from umbrasa gravelands) so unarmed combat ends up being my specialty.

Which means I end up needing a lot of the lower tier abilities.

But at the same time I like a lot of the higher tier abilities, so I pick one or two, like slipstream and inner eye or cosmic blast.

Well...you get the idea.

I just realized...you forgot two very important portfolios. Pain and pleasure.

Pain's favored class would be either the Scourged Vesper or the Carnifex. Both of which I can post if anyone wants them.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey guys!

I responded to a God of War thread in General Discussion a few days ago, talking briefly about Metamartial Maneouvres. I'd led me to expand that section slightly adding Throw Attack and an (as yest unnamed) attack which lets you wield your oponent like a weapon.

For Throw Attack the initial data seems to suggest:

Str 73

Throw Human 1 mile
Throw Iron Golem 80 ft.

Str 123

Throw human 1000 miles
Throw Iron Golem 16 miles
Throw Tarrasque 320 ft.

Str 163

Throw human to the Moon

Str 208

Throw human into the Sun

These changes also have repercussions for Mighty Attack as well. A Strength 73 Mighty Attack against a normal human should propel them 1 mile into the distance assuming the angle of the blow doesn't simply smack them down into the turf. What I would say though is if a Mighty Attack kills a target with one blow the target will just explode rather than be propelled the distance.

The best attack would seem to be a Mighty Attack which blasts an opponent standing on the ground) into some high building (causing crush damage), and then causes fall damage as well.

A few things still to iron out, but I think it could be a fun addition to the Metamartial combat options.

 

[Upper_Krust]

My DM is particularly cruel and likes to pound mere hero-deities with abominations.

Your DM will love Gods & Monsters then.

Its got She-Dragons, Gigantes and Animal Tyrant flavoured Abominations. Each is also based around a sort of unique construction kit where you get to build your own monsters (even more in depth than the original Abomination stuff).

So even though I only have the Scorpion King and Serpent Queen Animal Tyrnats detailed in the book you can just pick your own animals and make up your own Animal Tyrants using the framework I provide...same for the Gigantes and She-Dragons.

I just realized...you forgot two very important portfolios. Pain and pleasure.

I think you could tweak Revenge and Love.

Or alternately soeone else can make up some new portfolios more specifically tailored to their needs like you did with the Desert Portfolio which was very good. If I get enough Portfolios in these forums I'll put them on my website.

Pain's favored class would be either the Scourged Vesper or the Carnifex. Both of which I can post if anyone wants them.

Where are these classes from? Don't be posting someone elses published work - unless its your own. If it is your own feel free to use that thread you started rather than this one.

 

[Edheldur]

I responded to a God of War thread in General Discussion a few days ago, talking briefly about Metamartial Maneouvres. I'd led me to expand that section slightly adding Throw Attack and an (as yest unnamed) attack which lets you wield your oponent like a weapon.

After reading your post there, I can't help it but mention the similarities between what you described and the maneuver system presented in Mike Mearls' "Book of Iron Might" and to a lesser extent the Challenge rules presented by the same man in "Iron Heroes".

Not that it's a bad thing, but it was nice to see the same line of thought there.

 

[CRGreathouse]

I'm the last person to ask that question!

Its basically going to boil down to how many illustrations per day I can do. I'd like to think I can have it done for the end of April (my birthday incidently*) but my predictions are not known for their accuracy.

Well once it's out I'll surely buy it for full price. You'll no doubt need the money...

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey edheldur!

After reading your post there, I can't help it but mention the similarities between what you described and the maneuver system presented in Mike Mearls' "Book of Iron Might" and to a lesser extent the Challenge rules presented by the same man in "Iron Heroes".

Not that it's a bad thing, but it was nice to see the same line of thought there.

Interesting. I've never seen the Book of Iron Might although I do own Iron Heroes. However, those who have been following these various threads over the years (and I do mean years) will have heard me talk about Metamartial Maneouvres (originally Metamartial Feats) for quite some time. The origins of which were born out of the Power Attack mechanic, not some other writers ideas. However, they do say great minds think alike.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey CRGreathouse matey!

Well once it's out I'll surely buy it for full price.

I appreciate the support dude!

You'll no doubt need the money...

Hey...even immortals gotta eat!...oh wait...

 

[dante58701]

Near as I know they're open game content because they come from umbrasa and they only allow open game content to be posted. They even have a site disclaimer stating that anyone who posts their material there has to be careful not to post copyrighted stuff since they think you should be responsible for protecting your own copyrights, as it isnt really any of their affair. You should check it out sometime.

Just google Umbrasa Gravelands.

The community there is very friendly and very liberal. The carnifex and scourged vesper are posted there as well. Im sure they wont mind you using it if you ask nicely and give the original creator the credit for making them . Just askem about it and see what they say.
Id imagine something can be arranged.

 

[Edheldur]

Hey UK!

The origins of which were born out of the Power Attack mechanic, not some other writers ideas. However, they do say great minds think alike.

And it's a good thing that great minds think alike. Since I already use those systems, porting in yours should go without any problem.

 

[Pssthpok]

Hey hey, UK. How are ya?

Think we can get a progress report on Ascension?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hiya matey!

Hey hey, UK. How are ya?

Okay I guess.

Think we can get a progress report on Ascension?

I have all the errata spotted so far fixed, I may have an update on Sunday/Monday.

Also making early progress in terms of sketching the art. So I sort of know what I'll have on the cover and about half the interior illustrations.

 

[Pssthpok]

Sounds good; so we'll have an update next Wednesday?

 

[paradox42]

Does the above mean text-complete? Minus erratta that have yet to be discovered obviously?

 

[Gothenem]

Sounds good; so we'll have an update next Wednesday?

Ouch. I am still waiting. I unfortunately waited too long to preorder, and now I'm agnonizing 'cause I don't even get the sneak previews.

I writhe on the floor in agony :s

Ahh well, I know it'll be worth the wait. I enjoy the Epic Bestiary. It frightens all my players

 

[WarDragon]

Is the speed tripling from a divine template, or Celerity, applied before or after the Fast Movement class feature?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey WarDragon mate!

Is the speed tripling from a divine template, or Celerity, applied before or after the Fast Movement class feature?

Apply them in the order you gain them.