D&D (2024) Rogue's Been in an Awkward Place, And This Survey Might Be Our Last Chance to Let WotC Know.

[CapnZapp]

only if they make that crit doubles ALL damage, not just dice.

Sorry?

Increasing the size of the sneak die from d6 to d8 increases average damage by +1 per die, full stop. No need to involve crits or anything else into the calculation.

 

[CapnZapp]

sounds like a good 6th level ability for a subclass, oh, wait, they removed that, so we now have to wait for potential new subclass with extra attack till 9th level.

Again, Extra Attack is a poor thematic fit for the Rogue class, whose entire schtick is that of "not really a fighter".

There are much better ways of increasing the Rogue damage output.

 

[Horwath]

Again, Extra Attack is a poor thematic fit for the Rogue class, whose entire schtick is that of "not really a fighter".

There are much better ways of increasing the Rogue damage output.

this is a subclass idea for more fightery rogue.

 

[Horwath]

Sorry?

Increasing the size of the sneak die from d6 to d8 increases average damage by +1 per die, full stop. No need to involve crits or anything else into the calculation.

yes, but if you give +1 per die or increase d6 to d8, it's different on crit damage.
Personally, I like d6+1 more than d8 if crit multiplies all damage.

 

[tetrasodium]

Yes. Perhaps from the vantage point of a vanilla PHB rogue you did more damage than a vanilla fighter, but you certainly aren't doing more damage than a martial character that adds some oomph through items, magic abilities and/or or items, especially when you factor in Extra Attack.

Partially because WotC completely forgot to give the Rogue similar freebies to play with. If there existed Rogue subclasses that offered build choices to increase Sneak damage (at the expense of other fun Rogue things) we wouldn't be having this discussion.

I don't think they "forgot". So many of those were put in the base classthat the subclassesdidn't have room to do the same.

 

[CapnZapp]

Those were official items I linked to pages that described the items in MiC because it's been several years and because wotc literally have all of them to the base class as permanent at will things.

I visited the site again but can honestly see no trace of any "officialness". I'll have to take your word for it.

Even then, I don't see why you would link to something like a Truedeath Crystal...?

The Deathstrike Bracers theoretically boosts sneak attacks, but the amount of monsters immune to sneak damage must be minuscule. Not exactly an item that fixes an entire class ability, no? (Again assuming you're still discussing 5E - in 3E it was quite common to encounter monsters immune to sneak damage; there these bracers would definitely have a value.)

There is no room for sneak attack improving items because the ua rogue is already a very powerful class that probably even has it too good with some of its new abilities...

I can understand that, since every rogue would presumable be able to use this items.

So class feautures it is (since you would presumably have to choose between "moar" damage and those "too good" features you're talking about)

 

[UngeheuerLich]

sounds like a good 6th level ability for a subclass, oh, wait, they removed that, so we now have to wait for potential new subclass with extra attack till 9th level.

Brute subclass:
3rd level: proficiency with all weapons and armor,
no stealth penalty with armor,
sneak attack works with all weapons(this should be default, but hey)

9th(6th) level: extra attack.
You can sneak attack twice per turn, but not on a same target.

13th(10th) level: proficiency in Con and Str saves

17th(14th) level: quick strike, make one weapon attack as a Bonus action.
you can sneak attack 3 times per round.
you can sneak attack same target twice per round.

Now you turn good into too good.

 

[CapnZapp]

yes, but if you give +1 per die or increase d6 to d8, it's different on crit damage.
Personally, I like d6+1 more than d8 if crit multiplies all damage.

Okay.

I was merely answering a question: how would the die increase change damage. That answer is "+1 per die".

I made no comment on the attractiveness of this particular solution over any other.

 

[CapnZapp]

I don't think they "forgot". So many of those were put in the base classthat the subclassesdidn't have room to do the same.

Not sure what "those" refers to here.

There's definitely room design and balance wise for more sneak damage if we're still discussing the 5E14 Rogue. I could easily see a whole subclass dedicated to this focus.

 

[CapnZapp]

this is a subclass idea for more fightery rogue.

Ah.

Carry on then.