D&D 5E The Int 8 Party: A Solution?

[Corwin]

Now you can have your optimized stats, but don't bring that unique strategy, or solve puzzles every time or you'll get less xp. How optimized is that character now?

This invalidates entire tropes and enjoyable experiences, such as the Inspector Clouseau factor, for example. No thanks.

 

[BookBarbarian]

I considered limiting the bonus proficiencies to Int-based ones, but then I thought, hey, there are some really brilliant people out there who are not "book smart" but know their way around a car engine, or the swamp, or what-have-you far better than most. I'd just let it be any skill.

Interesting. I would model one of these brilliant, but not book-smart people with a low INT score but having the right skill proficiencies rather than giving them a high INT score, but hey that just might be how 5e has trained my to do it.

 

[ClearlyTough69]

I agree that Intelligence it too weak. I have two solutions:

New effects of Intelligence
Reward high Intelligence and punish low Intelligence as follows: start in the middle and stack up the effects as you go up or down until you reach your Intelligence score. Eg if your Intelligence is 5, you lose a language and can't write.

Intelligence Effect

21 gain proficiency with a new tool

19 gain a language

17 gain proficiency in a new skill

15 gain proficiency with a new tool (except Thieves' tools)

13 gain a language

9 - 12 START HERE!

8 lose a language

6 unable to write any languages you know

4 unable to read any languages you know

2 unable to speak or understand any languages

I have used odd numbers above 11, and even numbers below 10 so that every point by which you change your Intelligence has a noticeable effect (rather than every two points, which is how modifiers change).

Making Intelligence harder to dump
2.A. Don't use point buy

2.B. I get my players to roll their ability scores in order, 4d6 drop lowest. They can discard any character whose ability score total is less than 66. They can also swap two scores, but in one of only three ways: swap lowest and highest score; swap second lowest and second highest scores; swap the two middlemost scores.

 

[schnee]

I considered limiting the bonus proficiencies to Int-based ones, but then I thought, hey, there are some really brilliant people out there who are not "book smart" but know their way around a car engine, or the swamp, or what-have-you far better than most. I'd just let it be any skill.

They have high INT too, but just operate in a different cultural context.

My brother is an auto mechanic, and his knowledge of car components and mechanical reasoning is as book-smart encyclopedic and as real-world tested as any senior bench scientist.

 

[zaratan]

This invalidates entire tropes and enjoyable experiences, such as the Inspector Clouseau factor, for example. No thanks.

Au contraire, mon ami. This make you do the character you want to roleplay and know you'll be rewarded if you do it right.
Inspector Clouseau could be dumb in many things, but get his brightness one time or another. An low int with proficiency in investigation (maybe expertise) can cover that. But don't came with you Inspector Clouseau build that never do nothing wrong.
Isn't because you have int 8 you need to be brainless all the time, but you'll be in a lot of situations. XP for roleplaying isn't just about the stat in you sheet, is what you propose in your background, traits, ideals, bonds and flaws.

Xp for roleplaying ins't just for Int part, this can avoid abuse of metagaming, reward players that increase the content of the story, and punish players who don't follow they character concept (probably because they only did that build for min/max).

You want to play that muticlass paladin of Bahamut with Warlock Orcus patron? Fine, but I want to see your internal conflicts about that.

 

[BoldItalic]

NPCs use Int as a dump stat too. So over the whole campaign world, the average human Int is actually 6, not 10~11. The PCs are marginally smarter than the average NPC and should be role-played accordingly. Problem solved.

 

[Corwin]

Au contraire, mon ami. This make you do the character you want to roleplay and know you'll be rewarded if you do it right.
Inspector Clouseau could be dumb in many things, but get his brightness one time or another. An low int with proficiency in investigation (maybe expertise) can cover that. But don't came with you Inspector Clouseau build that never do nothing wrong.
Isn't because you have int 8 you need to be brainless all the time, but you'll be in a lot of situations. XP for roleplaying isn't just about the stat in you sheet, is what you propose in your background, traits, ideals, bonds and flaws.

Xp for roleplaying ins't just for Int part, this can avoid abuse of metagaming, reward players that increase the content of the story, and punish players who don't follow they character concept (probably because they only did that build for min/max).

You want to play that muticlass paladin of Bahamut with Warlock Orcus patron? Fine, but I want to see your internal conflicts about that.

None of this corresponds with the opinion you stated earlier. Good to see you are distancing yourself from your previous post.

 

[zaratan]

None of this corresponds with the opinion you stated earlier. Good to see you are distancing yourself from your previous post.

Yeah, probably I shorted too much the concept in the first reply. You really should played RPGs that reward roleplay to understand what I was talking about, sorry.

Treat the concept how I stated in my second reply.

 

[Kalshane]

Neither do I. Pointing out that the problems being discussed are by no means universal is not blaming people for having a problem. The Op started out with; "In 5E, Intelligence is a dump stat for almost everyone except Wizards." If this doesn't seem to be the case in actual play then what is the issue with pointing that out?

By no means am I denying that it's a problem for some, obviously it is as I have seen it discussed in forums before. I'm not suggesting that they shouldn't try to modify the game in a way that works better for them.

Oh yeah, I do play with people care more about realizing a particular character and a whole host of things more than they do about which stat is more valuable, but I wasn't just talking about my game. I looked up the stats on games like Dice, camera, action and Critical role, etc. before and they all showed similar results.

ETA; I just double checked to see if I was wrong as I don't watch Critical role. There are 18 character sheets listed on their site, 1 has Int as a dump stat, one has it tied with Dex at 10.

Well, Critical Role uses rolled stats, so it's not quite the same as point-buy, though they do get to pick which stat goes where. (Amusingly, the highest Intelligence in the party (20) belongs to the Fighter. Though his whole schtick is he's an inventor.) The barbarian player (he of the 6 Int) does a really good job of RPing his character's intelligence (though every once in awhile he forgets and says/does something too smart. Though he usually catches himself and says/does something to counteract it immediately thereafter.)

I haven't seen much Intelligence dump-statting in my own groups (both as a player and as a DM.) I think, for the most part, we're all reasonably intelligent people and don't want to have to worry in the moment "Wait, would my character actually be able to think of that?" I also have a house rule when I DM granting extra tools/languages.

 

[Shadowdweller00]

Int, as it stands, is the worst stat in the game, bar none. Even the classes that should need it like eldritch knight and arcane trickster can manage builds keeping it low by taking the right spell selection, and the skills linked to the stat are highly situational.

I'm afraid that statement is outright, objectively wrong. The amount of information or other benefit the DM provides on a successful Int check is entirely DM-dependent. The difficulty of that check is entirely DM-dependent. The importance of that benefit is also DM dependent. Getting the idea? The importance of Intelligence (or any other stat) is subjective. This is like saying that the color red is the worst of all colors, bar none.