TSR TSR3.5 Launches IndieGogo Campaign to "Stop" WotC

The latest in the TSR3 saga, which has gone quiet for a while, is a new IndieGoGo campaign launched to "stop Wizards of the Coast". They cite wrongful bullying of TSR, and refusal to answer requests that WotC show TSR "proof of their claims" (although the campaign page doesn't mention what those claims are).

The IndieGoGo campaign was launched yesterday and has so far raised $675 (at the time of writing).

The action TSR seeks is a "Trademark Declaratory Judgement of Ownership" which is a court declaration about the status of something in dispute.

TSR has launched a campaign to stop Wizards of the Coast

Become a Champion of TSR and Support TSR’s campaign against Wizards of the Coast!

TSR is taking a stand against Wizards of the Coast (“WOTC”) and its wrongful bullying of TSR, our trademarks, and its public libeling and slander of all those who helped create TSR based Dungeons & Dragons and products.

Wizards of the Coast has continually bullied TSR regarding TSR’s legally owned Trademarks. Wizards of the Coast has refused to answer all of TSR's repeated requests that they show any proof of their claims. Wizards of the Coast has the vast resources behind them and is implying to bring them to bear down on TSR.


The new TSR suffered widespread pushback when it launched, which they blamed on WotC, claiming that they were under a "coordinated assault across various channels being mounted.... by [WotC]" The company announced itself earlier this year, having acquired the TSR trademark after the previous holder accidentally let it lapse. It was run by Ernie Gygax, Justin LaNasa, and Stephen Dinehart. After several weeks of controversy, the company split into two -- Wonderfilled (Stephen Dinehart), and TSR (Ernie Gygax and Justin LaNasa).


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The page also indicates an intention to "fight to have WotC's legacy product disclaimer removed" from older products (that's the disclaimer on the older books available on DMs Guild which indicates that those books are products of their time) by claiming that the disclaimer portrays the creators of those older products as "as supporting those alleged prejudices, stereotypes and bigotry, wrongfully claimed to be part of those products".


TSR will also Fight to Have the WOTC Legacy Disclaimer Removed

TSR is suing WOTC for Trademark Declaratory Judgement of Ownership . TSR will also pursue in the near future having WOTC remove the legacy content disclaimer placed on TSR based Dungeons & Dragons and other products, and retractions of any other libel and slander which alleges that racism and other heinous beliefs are incorporated into those products.

This disclaimer attempts to make a statement of fact argument, and therefore paints all of the writers, editors, artists and consumers of those products as supporting those alleged prejudices, stereotypes and bigotry, wrongfully claimed to be part of those products. This statement by Wizards of the Coast opens the possibility for the producers and players of these "Legacy Products" to face ridicule, and face the labeling as "bigots", "racists", "misogynists", and worse Cyber & Physical Attacks!

Wizards of the Coast legacy content disclaimer.

"We (Wizards) recognize that some of the legacy content available on this website does not reflect the values of the Dungeons & Dragons franchise today. Some older content may reflect ethnic, racial, and gender prejudice that were commonplace in American society at that time. These depictions were wrong then and are wrong today. This content is presented as it was originally created, because to do otherwise would be the same as claiming these prejudices never existed. Dungeons & Dragons teaches that diversity is a strength, and we strive to make our D&D products as welcoming and inclusive as possible. This part of our work will never end".


TSR3's Justin LaNasa spoke about the campaign in a YouTube video.


 
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Russ Morrissey

Russ Morrissey


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Jer

Legend
Supporter
Riggs actually led off his presentation with this fact. He mentioned how many of the policies of TSR that led to its ruin were also the same policies that allowed these IPs to come to fruition. It was quite interesting.
Dancey said basically the same thing when he reviewed their books - and that's why for 3.x they stayed away from having diverse product releases and instead tried to make everything a book everyone could use. I wonder now if Dancey knew the details about the Random House deal or if he just had the broad strokes and just seeing the fallout.

Flames don't count as actual fire. (More's the pity.)
And an acid tongue doesn't count as acid.
 




UngainlyTitan

Legend
Supporter
Huh? Williams was in charge of selling D&D for longer than Gary, wasn’t she? She also had much higher revenue as well, didn’t she?
WotC has been selling D&D longer than either of them, combined, and has probably made more money.
How dare you, sir! to be reasonable in the face of long held prejudices, stoked in the fires of long dead bulletin boards before the days of the "Endless September"
 

Kannik

Adventurer
Magic The Gathering was definitely a huge boost for their coffers. I remember that D&D wasn't selling as well (sales were falling as people started losing interest), then that game came out and sold like crazy.
This... wait... what? MTG saved WotC from poor D&D sales years before WotC acquired D&D? That's some serious fourth dimensional power there, clearly those magic-users by the shore are of epic level if they can pull off those kind of time shenanigans!

Not that everything else you've said has been so over the top hogwash that they venture into parody territory, but this basic lack of understanding of a calendar truly removes any shred of credibility to your posts.
 

CleverNickName

Limit Break Dancing
It looks like the last update on the IndieGoGo page was on January 28th, from LaNasa. He reports "WOTC filing Against TSR CANCELLED", and then reaffirms that NuTSR will push to have the legacy content disclaimer removed or changed. There is no mention of logos, trademarks, libel, slander, or any of the other issues he took with Wizards of the Coast on their original IGG page.

So I get the feeling it's all about the Legacy Content Disclaimer for this crowd, from now on.

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I'm fascinated to see how LaNasa plans to force Wizards of the Coast to change their own disclaimer, on their own sales page, for their own products. I mean, what is that argument even going to look like?

"You guys need to stop saying that you recognize your values have changed! Stop reminding us that older products were products of a different time! If I want to believe that prejudice doesn't exist, you have no right to tell me otherwise! I swear if you don't stop referring to diversity as a strength, I'll call my lawyers!"
 
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adamantyr

Adventurer
That was never anything but a means to garner support from the gullible older gamers, who considered the disclaimer an insult.

Not that the lawsuit would have even made it possible for LaNasa to ever do anything about it. All their lawsuit focuses on is trademarks, which are not IP/copyrights.

I halfway wonder if the plan all along was to try and get in front of a judge and jury and have some major dramatic reveal like "I have on this piece of paper a written agreement that TSR belongs to Ernie, signed by Gary himself!" :rolleyes: Which, by the way, wouldn't work.
 

Jer

Legend
Supporter
I'm fascinated to see how LaNasa plans to force Wizards of the Coast to change their own disclaimer, on their own sales page, for their own products. I mean, what is that argument even going to look like?

"You guys need to stop saying that you recognize your values have changed! Stop reminding us that older products were products of a different time! If I want to believe that prejudice doesn't exist, you have no right to tell me otherwise! I swear if you don't stop referring to diversity as a strength, I'll call my lawyers!"
I mean, I suspect that's exactly the argument. I think his "plan" such as it was was to play to the folks who are outraged over the fact that times actually have changed to get money, and to have a jury trial over it so that he can get likeminded folks on the jury to give him a win.

The thing about guys who are outraged that times have changed is that they surround themselves with guys who think likewise and are convinced that everyone is as outraged as they are. I suspect that the person who was most surprised by the Indiegogo flop was probably LaNasa himself because of that mindset.
 

CleverNickName

Limit Break Dancing
The thing about guys who are outraged that times have changed is that they surround themselves with guys who think likewise and are convinced that everyone is as outraged as they are. I suspect that the person who was most surprised by the Indiegogo flop was probably LaNasa himself because of that mindset.
Yep, the classic "echo chamber" fallacy. If you surround yourself with people who only agree with you, and isolate yourself from people who disagree, you will convince yourself that the whole world agrees with you.

And given Justin's penchant for blocking/ignoring everyone who disagrees with him....
 
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Sacrosanct

Legend
Publisher
Yep, the classic "echo chamber" fallacy. If you surround yourself with people who only agree with you, and isolate yourself from people wo disagree, you will convince yourself that the whole world agrees with you.

And given Justin's penchant for blocking/ignoring everyone who disagrees with him..
I'm in luck then, because hardly anyone agrees with me, no matter who I hang out with :p
 




"You guys need to stop saying that you recognize your values have changed! Stop reminding us that older products were products of a different time! If I want to believe that prejudice doesn't exist, you have no right to tell me otherwise! I swear if you don't stop referring to diversity as a strength, I'll call my lawyers!"
If someone says "we don't like racism" and you feel personally attacked by that, it says a lot more about you than it does about the other person.
 



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