D&D General What is appropriate Ranger Magic

[Horwath]

The conversation was about making the Ranger get magic as a subclass. @Micah Sweet said they would be preferable.

I said that Wildborn Ranger is a 1/3 caster while the WOTC Ranger is a 1/2 caster. So the player who wants a magical ranger loses out to please the needs of the players who wants a non spellcasting one. You'd have to make the Wildborn a 1/2 caster to please both sides

However a 1/2 caster Wildborn A5e Ranger is very likely Overpowered all the way from level 1.

anything that is not a full caster cannot be overpowered

 

[Minigiant]

anything that is not a full caster cannot be overpowered

You obviously played with some bad players.

Playing D&D as intended, half casters are the strongest classes in 5e

 

[Horwath]

You obviously played with some bad players.

Playing D&D as intended, half casters are the strongest classes in 5e

only 2014 paladin doing 5MWD

 

[Minigiant]

only 2014 paladin doing 5MWD

Other way around.

Long adventures allow half casters to have a strong baseline and the ability to buff in tough spots.

Anyway.

Exploding Arrow​

3rd-level transmutation

Casting Time: 1 bonus action
Range: Self
Components: V, S
Duration: Instantaneous


As your attack hits or misses the target, the weapon or ammunition you’re using transforms into a fireball. Instead of dealing the weapon's damage or causing other effects from the attack, the target takes 8d6 Fire damage on a hit or half as much damage on a miss. Each creature within 20 feet of the target then makes a Dexterity saving throw, taking 4d8 Fire damage on a failed save or half as much damage on a successful one.

The weapon or ammunition then returns to its normal form.

Using a Higher-Level Spell Slot. The damage for both effects of the spell increases by 1d6 for each spell slot level above 4.

 

[Horwath]

Other way around.

Long adventures allow half casters to have a strong baseline and the ability to buff in tough spots.

Anyway.

Exploding Arrow​

3rd-level transmutation

Casting Time: 1 bonus action
Range: Self
Components: V, S
Duration: Instantaneous


As your attack hits or misses the target, the weapon or ammunition you’re using transforms into a fireball. Instead of dealing the weapon's damage or causing other effects from the attack, the target takes 8d6 Fire damage on a hit or half as much damage on a miss. Each creature within 20 feet of the target then makes a Dexterity saving throw, taking 4d8 Fire damage on a failed save or half as much damage on a successful one.

The weapon or ammunition then returns to its normal form.

Using a Higher-Level Spell Slot. The damage for both effects of the spell increases by 1d6 for each spell slot level above 4.

this would be better if it worked with the attack damage;

Bonus action
Components: M(piece of ammunition)
Duration: 1 round

when you attack with imbued ammunition, hit or miss attack deals 8d6(dex save for half) damage extra fire damage to everyone in 20ft radius. If attack hits target, target gets no save vs extra damage.

 

[Minigiant]

this would be better if it worked with the attack damage;

Bonus action
Components: M(piece of ammunition)
Duration: 1 round

when you attack with imbued ammunition, hit or miss attack deals 8d6(dex save for half) damage extra fire damage to everyone in 20ft radius. If attack hits target, target gets no save vs extra damage.

That's a little too much. Plus it gets wonky in writing.

Like what you wrote, the spell doesn't make any sense as written.

As my version written, you get to add you ability mod and other damage mods.

8d6+DEX+X.

 

[Horwath]

That's a little too much. Plus it gets wonky in writing.

Like what you wrote, the spell doesn't make any sense as written.

As my version written, you get to add you ability mod and other damage mods.

8d6+DEX+X.

yes, you get to add your normal attack damage plus 8d6.
it's ranger only spell(I guess) and comes 4 levels after fireball, it should atleast be better vs primary target(if it hits).
if not, it's just a fireball 4 levels too late.

 

[Minigiant]

yes, you get to add your normal attack damage plus 8d6.
it's ranger only spell(I guess) and comes 4 levels after fireball, it should atleast be better vs primary target(if it hits).
if not, it's just a fireball 4 levels too late.

Bonus action fireball that takes your buffs.

 

[Horwath]

Bonus action fireball that takes your buffs.

you still need your Action to trigger your Bonus action. So it's Action+Bonus action cost.

 

[Corinnguard]

I said that Wildborn Ranger is a 1/3 caster while the WOTC Ranger is a 1/2 caster. So the player who wants a magical ranger loses out to please the needs of the players who wants a non spellcasting one. You'd have to make the Wildborn a 1/2 caster to please both sides

There is an alternative way to please both sides. You could have one player play a WoTC Ranger and another player play a Level Up Ranger. Level Up is backwards compatible with 5e.

However a 1/2 caster Wildborn A5e Ranger is very likely Overpowered all the way from level 1.

How can you be so sure that it is overpowered? Especially when it and all of the other Level Up classes/subclasses were play tested. If the play testers thought it was overpowered, they would have told the Level Up designers about it.