D&D (2024) Down Leveling spells, from the Expert Classes playtest.

[Eyes of Nine]

Because of this. If you get all spells at level 1, be cleric 1, wizard 1 and then level anything up and cast every wizard an cleric spell as you wish. If there is no entry level like level 5 wizard for fireball, be wizard 1 and cleric 4 and happily throw 1 fireball after the other at spell level 3 potency.

I am not proposing to get rid of Spell Slot levels. I am only proposing to get rid of Spell Levels.

According the PHB for Wizards and Clerics, it doesn't matter how many wizard or cleric levels you have to have access to X level spells. It's whether you have the X-level spell slots. So yes, you can be a Bard 1 Sorcerer 1 Warlock 1 Cleric 1 Wizard 1 in the rules today because you will have 4 L1, 3 L2, and 2 L3 slots. Thus you will have access to Fireball if you either a) learn it at 5th level or b) get a spell book with it.

My proposal is you can be Wizard 1 and get Fireball. But since you only have a 1st level spell slot, you cast at 1st level and it is limited in comparison to the 3rd level slot.

If what I'm proposing isn't clear, I apologize. Maybe it would be easier to explain in person, maybe not. But I'm not super invested in an idea WotC won't ever adopt. And also, as someone noted, it would be SUPER Not-backwards-compatible. So it's off the table anyway. I don't think I'll spend more cycles discussing this idea.

I've got a different idea anyway that I'll throw out in another post

 

[Eyes of Nine]

I would love if in the new DMG, for damage dealing spells, the template was provided. It's tantalizingly close to transparent in the cantrips and 1st level spells: ie, psychic damage is 1d4, fire damage is 1d8, cold damage is 1d6 and apply slow condition on failed save, necrotic is 1d8 but 1d12 if already damaged; etc etc. Things scale as either the spellcaster levels or the slot level is increased. While the bones of the system can be seen - I'd love it if they made it explicit in the DMG so DMs can build their own spells that match their campaigns.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I am not proposing to get rid of Spell Slot levels. I am only proposing to get rid of Spell Levels.

According the PHB for Wizards and Clerics, it doesn't matter how many wizard or cleric levels you have to have access to X level spells. It's whether you have the X-level spell slots. So yes, you can be a Bard 1 Sorcerer 1 Warlock 1 Cleric 1 Wizard 1 in the rules today because you will have 4 L1, 3 L2, and 2 L3 slots. Thus you will have access to Fireball if you either a) learn it at 5th level or b) get a spell book with it.

My proposal is you can be Wizard 1 and get Fireball. But since you only have a 1st level spell slot, you cast at 1st level and it is limited in comparison to the 3rd level slot.

You should not get Fireball if your wizard level is only level 1.

In today's rules you won't get it, as you prepare spells as a wizard level 1, so only burning hands which you cam upcast to level 3, if you also have 4 levels of cleric (and thus level 3 slots).

 

[Edwin Suijkerbuijk]

Not read the whole tread just budding in based on the first few posts.

Downcasting can be interesting

One think I’d like to experiment with us upcasting cantrips.

Like mage hand to say, level 9 and you have that giant Start Trek hand crushing the Enterprise

If you do that you probably should combine the Mage hand and the Bigby hand spells into one.
What you can make the hand do depends on spell slot used.

 

[Eyes of Nine]

You should not get Fireball if your wizard level is only level 1.

Ok we'll just have to agree to disagree. My entire post was about the idea that you can get all spells (allowed to your class) at First class level - but the spells themselves get more powerful the higher level slot you spend on them.
And I believe that would be a cool way to do spells/magic in D&D.

If your position is that some spells just shouldn't be allowed until certain class levels - well then we don't seem to have common ground to move this conversation forward constructively.