Immortals Handbook - ASCENSION

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Phantom Llama (and Buugipopuu)!

Those new abilities look great, I'll go over them in more detail tomorrow.

 

[WarDragon]

Revisions of the abilities mentioned above, to make them more useful across tiers:

Perfect Body
You are a perfect physical specimen.
Benefit: You gain 8 ability points, which may be distributed as you please between Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution, on a 1-for-1 basis.
Special: This ability can be taken more than once, and its effects stack.


Perfect Mind
You are a perfect mental specimen.
Benefit: You gain 8 ability points, which may be distributed as you please between Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma, on a 1-for-1 basis.
Special: This ability can be taken more than once, and its effects stack.

 

[mercucio]

DIVINE SORCERY (SU)
Prerequisites: Spellcraft 40 Ranks.

Benefit: You can cast double your normal amount of spells per day.


DIVINE WIZARDRY (SU)
Prerequisites: Spellcraft 40 Ranks.

Benefit: You know twice as many spells per day.

Hi U_K. I figured I'd get a quicker answer/feedback here than on DF . The above two divine abilities don't seem to really adhere to your maxim that 6 feats (epic or non-epic) equal one Divine Ability.

1. Assuming that Divine Sorcery is meant to double a spellcaster's spells per day (be they spell slots or prepared spells) this means a sorcerer gains an additional 54 spell slots total and a wizard an addition 36 spell slots. The equivalent of receiving your version of Improved Spellcasting x27 or x18 respectively. To phrase it another way as written Divine Sorcery grants the equivalent of Multi-Faceted x4.5 or x3 (for wizards).

2. Assuming Divine Wizardry is meant to double your spells known (for spontaneous spellcasters) or spells automatically gained per wizard level we run into two issues. The first is as described above. Doubling a sorcerer's spells known grants an extra 34 spells known, or the equivalent of Spell Knowledge (from the Epic SRD) x17, or the equivalent of Multi-Faceted x3.

Second, no wizard will every take this ability. Who cares if you can add 2 more spells per wizard level to you spell book when you can add any spell you find or research for free?


In light of above I'd suggest replacing Divine Sorcery and Divine Wizardry with the following:


DIVINE SPELLCASTING (SU)
Prerequisites: Spellcraft 40 Ranks, ability to cast 1st level spells.

Benefit: If you prepare your spells each day you can prepare two additional spells per spell level you can cast, to a maximum of 9th level. If you cast your spells spontaneously each day you gain two additional spell slots per spell level you can cast, to a maximum of 9th level.


DIVINE SPELL KNOWLEDGE (SU)
Prerequisites: Knowledge (arcana) 40 Ranks, ability to spontaneously cast 1st level spells.

Benefit: You learn two additional spells per spell level you can cast, to a maximum of 9th lebel.

 

[Pssthpok]

Revisions of the abilities mentioned above, to make them more useful across tiers:

Perfect Body
You are a perfect physical specimen.
Benefit: You gain 8 ability points, which may be distributed as you please between Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution, on a 1-for-1 basis.
Special: This ability can be taken more than once, and its effects stack.


Perfect Mind
You are a perfect mental specimen.
Benefit: You gain 8 ability points, which may be distributed as you please between Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma, on a 1-for-1 basis.
Special: This ability can be taken more than once, and its effects stack.

Not feeling it here, WD. These "rewrites", while more flexible, offer less in effect and will see less application than the standard, IMO.

 

[WarDragon]

Not feeling it here, WD. These "rewrites", while more flexible, offer less in effect and will see less application than the standard, IMO.

But, as written, the current ones offer no benefit at all, because U_K allows infinite non-Epic wealth to all immortals, even Disciples and Prophets. That means any creature with a deity template can read a +5 tome for each stat, which doesn't stack with the divine abilities. There's only a point to them if the "Undergods" are exempt from the artifacts rule, and continue to use standard wealth tables.

 

[Ltheb Silverfrond]

But, as written, the current ones offer no benefit at all, because U_K allows infinite non-Epic wealth to all immortals, even Disciples and Prophets. That means any creature with a deity template can read a +5 tome for each stat, which doesn't stack with the divine abilities. There's only a point to them if the "Undergods" are exempt from the artifacts rule, and continue to use standard wealth tables.

I am pretty sure Disciples and Prophets still have to aquire wealth "normally." (Just tithe your deities' followers )
The semi-divine still might possess artifacts, though it is doubtful; U_K plans to detail Artifact creation in Grimoire, and I would guess this entails expending quintessence - Not something easy to come by at such levels. (Sure, kill a dozen Balors or so, but when a Demon Lord notices some peon killing his minions, expect retribution)
In short, those Divine powers are like Toughness; It may help you survive at (divine)level 1, but come (divine)level 20, you definitely have better options.

 

[Ltheb Silverfrond]

DIVINE SPELLCASTING (SU)
Prerequisites:[/B] Spellcraft 40 Ranks, ability to cast 1st level spells.

Benefit: If you prepare your spells each day you can prepare two additional spells per spell level you can cast, to a maximum of 9th level. If you cast your spells spontaneously each day you gain two additional spell slots per spell level you can cast, to a maximum of 9th level.


DIVINE SPELL KNOWLEDGE (SU)
Prerequisites: Knowledge (arcana) 40 Ranks, ability to spontaneously cast 1st level spells.

Benefit: You learn two additional spells per spell level you can cast, to a maximum of 9th lebel.

Makes sense. I don't think these are too terribly strong given all the options available to 20+level mages. All it does is make sure you never run out of spells or have every option available. (Something any epic mage or god should already be able to do. These just do it in a way that yes, you can still run out. I don't wanna mess with whatever makes you run out though)
Compared to the Cosmic options a wizard or Sorcerer gets - (Infinite spells/all spells, or Alter Reality, which ironically does both) - These seem to fit nicely. I have played in quite a few epic games, and run a good share myself, and I have yet to see an epic mage come even remotely close to running out of steam under most circumstances. Multispell sure could let a mage spam quite a few spells each round, but in most games, it's quality over quantity - Anything you can afford to spam, the foe is probably immune/resistant to.

I'd say you abilities, mercucio, work just as nicely, but U_K's are a bit simpler in wording.
Not everything needs to be explicitly spelled out, unless it has some sort of complex mechanic. Toughness just flat says you get 3 hp. It doesn't go on to say this is in addition to the Hp granted from hit dice and constitution, etc. Nor does it list that these hit points work like all other hit points.
Now, if you try to pass off Telluric Effect or Soniferous with only a simple wording, be prepared for trouble.

Which reminds me, U_K, two things reguarding Effects - Vampiric and Siphoning Effect;

Vampiric - Does this apply just to hit point damage? The way its worded, if I use it with a poison bolt, and deal 5 points of constitution damage, I heal 2 hit points. Weird huh? Another oddity: Wanna heal fast? Take this plus Karmic effect. It deals "experience point damage" which, since it is damage, seems like it would heal me about 255 hp per die!

Siphoning - It says it steals quintessence, but it doesn't specifically state that You recieve them. Perhaps a secound sentance or phrase mentioning the attacking deity gains the quintessence?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey guys!

Okay, the Surtur preview is finished, but I wanted to post it here as a pdf file. Unfortunately I don't seem to be able to attach anything - this could be something to do with the Pentagon level security protocols on my computer...?

If I emailed this to someone (its 200k), could they create a thread for it (here in these forums) and attach it?

I just want to get some feedback before I 'image capture' the pages and put them on my website.

EDIT: Okay, its just going to have to wait until the morning then.

 

[Frobojoe]

Hey guys!

Okay, the Surtur preview is finished, but I wanted to post it here as a pdf file. Unfortunately I don't seem to be able to attach anything - this could be something to do with the Pentagon level security protocols on my computer...?

If I emailed this to someone (its 200k), could they create a thread for it (here in these forums) and attach it?

I just want to get some feedback before I 'image capture' the pages and put them on my website.

EDIT: Okay, its just going to have to wait until the morning then.

I can give it a shot, if you want.

 

[Anabstercorian]

Minor errata: page 16, second sentence of the first paragraph: "This can only be gained by any being; however, it only manifests for immortals." should probably be changed to "This can be gained by any being; however, it only manifests for immortals."