Intensify Spell is an Epic WASTE!!!!

[HEL Pit Fiend]

No sane wizard should waste a slot with the Intensify Spell feat...

Lets take the example in the ELH of an intensified horrid wilting (note that an Intensified 8th level spell requires a 15th level slot)...

Their wizard, feat progression
21st -- improved spell capacity (10th)
23rd -- improved spell capacity (11th)
24th -- improved spell capacity (12th)
26th -- improved spell capacity (13th)
27th -- intensify spell (30 ranks required)
28th -- improved spell capacity (14th)
30th -- improved spell capacity (15th)

their wizard's Horrid Wilting damage (25x16) = 400 points

obvious disadvantages:
intensify spell cannot be stacked with empower or maximize feats, basically horrid wilting maxes out, damage wise, at 15th level with the intensify spell feat.



My wizard, feat progression
21st -- improved spell capacity (10th)
23rd -- improved spell capacity (11th)
24th -- improved spell capacity (12th)
26th -- improved spell capacity (13th)
27th -- improved metamagic (all metamagic -1 modifier)
28th -- improved spell capacity (14th)
30th -- improved spell capacity (15th)

my wizard's Horrid Wilting damage (empowered x 7) = 506 points average damage...

obvious advantages:
1. horrid wilting can be further empowered indefinately (and even maximized once) as spell capacity is improved beyond 15th level.
2. other metamagic feats are at -1 level (i.e. quicken spell +3 level adjustment, maximize +2 level adjustment, etc)

It's a no brainer...

 

[Crothian]

Ya, but at least you can say you did it. Or if you took Improved Metamagic 6 times so the modifier was only +1.

 

[kreynolds]

No sane wizard should waste a slot with the Intensify Spell feat...

The multi-empower vs. maximize argument is an old one. Intensify Spell is just a better form of empowering and then maximizing, so this shouldn't really come as a shock to anyone.

their wizard's Horrid Wilting damage (25x16) = 400 points

my wizard's Horrid Wilting damage (empowered x 7) = 506 points average damage...

Personally, I'll take a guaranteed 400 points of damage over an "average" of 506 any day of the week.

It's a no brainer...

Oh, I'm not too sure about that.

 

[kreynolds]

Or if you took Improved Metamagic 6 times so the modifier was only +1.

LOL Well, there is always that, isn't there?

 

[HEL Pit Fiend]

Ya, but at least you can say you did it. Or if you took Improved Metamagic 6 times so the modifier was only +1.

True, true, but every time their wizard takes improved metamagic (six times for a -6 adjustment), my wizard will take improved spell capacity 6 times (thats 21st level slots baby!!), or other interesting feats...

Therefore, (assuming my wizard took 6 more improved spellcasting feats):

their wizard horrid wilting at a 9th level slot = 400 points

my wizards horrid wilting at a 21st level slot = 844 points, half damage is 422 points


can you say "Nuclear Blast".....

 

[kreynolds]

your their

Well...which is it? "Your" or "their"?

their wizard horrid wilting at a 9th level slot = 400 points

my wizards horrid wilting at a 21st level slot = 844 points, half damage is 422 points

And just how many times per day do you think your wizard can pull off a 21st level spell? Not enough, so don't lose initiative.

Also, I'm curious as to how you came up with 844 points of damage.

 

[Crothian]

Can you double Intensify a spell? I would think they would specifically say if you could not like they say you can't Maximize or Empower it. It seems like you cannot, but just checking.

 

[HEL Pit Fiend]

Re: Re: Intensify Spell is an Epic WASTE!!!!

Personally, I'll take a guaranteed 400 points of damage over an "average" of 506 any day of the week.

Can I suggest you put that on a bell curve and calculate what the probability of rolling less that 400 is, you may find it less than you think....

And just how many times per day do you think your wizard can pull off a 21st level spell? Not enough, so don't lose initiative.

ok you got me there, guess after I burn my 21st level spell, Ill just have to depend on my 20th and 19th level spells, BUMMER....

Also, I'm curious as to how you came up with 844 points of damage.

Easy, thats an 8th level spell empowered 13 times or 7.5 times base damage.

112.5 x 7.5 = 843.75

 

[HEL Pit Fiend]

Or if you took Improved Metamagic 6 times so the modifier was only +1.

Now THAT my friend would be a true Epic WASTE of a WIZARD. There is absolutely no sense in taking Improved Metamagic more than 3 times for obvious reasons.

 

[kreynolds]

Re: Re: Re: Intensify Spell is an Epic WASTE!!!!

Can I suggest you put that on a bell curve and calculate what the probability of rolling less that 400 is, you may find it less than you think....

Do you roll my dice? Nope. Besides, "average damage" isn't entirely reliable. You might average 506 points of damage, but you might roll really crappy. You might roll really good. Guaranteed 400 points, 200 on a save? No risk? Done!

ok you got me there, guess after I burn my 21st level spell, Ill just have to depend on my 20th and 19th level spells, BUMMER....

What's your point? The other wizard will have 19th and 20th level spells too. Look, this is quickly degrading into a "MINE IS BIGGER THAN YOURS!!!" argument.

I'm just saying that I don't like the averages, that's all. Given a choice between average and guarantee, I'll take guarantee. That's just the kinda guy I am.

Easy, thats an 8th level spell empowered 13 times or 7.5 times base damage.

112.5 x 7.5 = 843.75

Cool. Thanks. This is the funny part though. Your damage on this could possibly be as high as 1,500 points of damage, and it can also possibly be as low as 37.5 points of damage. I hate averages.