Odd but legal?

[Hypersmurf]

When you make your offhand attacks with the longsword that was previously in your main hand, it's not a "second weapon". Sure, you have a weapon in your main hand and your offhand the entire time, but you're striking with the same weapon, so it doesn't qualify.

So if I throw multiple daggers, and the first dagger is the 'second weapon', doesn't that make the second dagger a 'third weapon'?

-Hyp.

 

[hong]

So if I throw multiple daggers, and the first dagger is the 'second weapon', doesn't that make the second dagger a 'third weapon'?

I think we are again confused.

 

[UnsocialEntity]

So if I throw multiple daggers, and the first dagger is the 'second weapon', doesn't that make the second dagger a 'third weapon'?

-Hyp.

I'm sorry, you sort of confused me there. Could you give a complete example of the actions you'd be taking? The first dagger is the 'second weapon' seems to be what's throwing me off. I think I may have missed a post somewhere far back.

As far as throwing weapons in general however, from the SRD for quick draw:
A character who has selected this feat may throw weapons at his full normal rate of attacks (much like a character with a bow).

So as far as throwing daggers, it acts like ammunition such as a bow with arrows. It no longer acts as seperate weapons. The feat itself "breaks" the normal rules, as listed.

 

[James McMurray]

I've got three weapons!

The longsword and two different daggers.

And during any given attack, I have a second weapon in my off-hand.

-Hyp.

The rules require you to attack with that second weapon*, not just have it around and drop it. Attacking with the first weapon is one weapon fighting. I can't find any text about one weapon fighting that gives you bonus attacks for wielding a first weapon in your off hand.

* You know, that rule that at least three people have quoted but you've ignored?

 

[Veril]

In fact I believe you have to declare your intention to atttack with the 2nd weapon and take the penalties for it. but in fact you can choose not to hit.

 

[James McMurray]

That's true. You can't take any offhand attacks unless you've already taken the penalty for your main hand attacks, but the turn sequence allows you to stop at any time. In flavor text turns, effectively what you've done is gone to the effort to seek openings with your off hand, then declined to take any that popped up.

 

[Hypersmurf]

As far as throwing weapons in general however, from the SRD for quick draw:
A character who has selected this feat may throw weapons at his full normal rate of attacks (much like a character with a bow).

Let's say we have a character with a BAB of +6, ITWF, and Quick Draw.

What is his full normal rate of attacks? How many attacks can he make with a bow? How many attacks can he make throwing daggers with both hands?

-Hyp.

 

[James McMurray]

4 attacks. 2 iterative attacks, one offhand attack, and one additional offhand attack for Improved Two Weapon Fighting.

 

[Hypersmurf]

That's true. You can't take any offhand attacks unless you've already taken the penalty for your main hand attacks, but the turn sequence allows you to stop at any time. In flavor text turns, effectively what you've done is gone to the effort to seek openings with your off hand, then declined to take any that popped up.

And this goes back to the zombie/skeleton axe/mace example.

If both of these are permissible:

1. Primary attack with longsword vs zombie; off-hand attack with handaxe vs zombie.
2. Primary attack with longsword vs zombie; drop handaxe; quick draw mace; 5' step; off-hand attack with mace vs skeleton.

... then 'seeking openings' is something that can be done throughout the course of the full attack action. The fact that my off-hand weapon has changed during the round doesn't matter - I have an off-hand weapon when I wish to make an off-hand attack.

If you disagree that scenario 2 is legal (since the off-hand weapon is not the one I started with), then absolutely, it is not feasible to make both attacks with the longsword.

-Hyp.

 

[Hypersmurf]

4 attacks. 2 iterative attacks, one offhand attack, and one additional offhand attack for Improved Two Weapon Fighting.

That's how many attacks he can make with a bow?

-Hyp.