The entry in the dmg is pretty pointless because 5e got rid of the tactical elements that made it a thing worth doing at times.
D&D (2024) Rogue's Been in an Awkward Place, And This Survey Might Be Our Last Chance to Let WotC Know.
- Thread starter Soulknife_Infiltrator
- Start date
Maxperson
Morkus from Orkus
Some things are baked into the class because of old movies. I was looking for the one where they jump from the ground 30 feet into trees.
UngeheuerLich
Legend
The more I see those threads, I think dex should be split into agility and precision.
And str should be merged with con as stamina.
Precision is the attack stat for everything. Stamina is just a requirement to use equippment and hp.
And agility is everything that has to do with movement.
And str should be merged with con as stamina.
Precision is the attack stat for everything. Stamina is just a requirement to use equippment and hp.
And agility is everything that has to do with movement.
hgjertsen
Explorer
Meh, I don't like the idea of making every class extremely MAD and samey, it makes some narrative sense that a fighter who swings around a greatsword all day has better equipment carrying ability and more meat on their bones.
Vikingkingq
Adventurer
That's a fair point; maybe Step of the Wind could be changed to say that you can use Dex (Acrobatics) in place of Strength (Athletics) for the purpose of jumping?
Some things are baked into the class because of old movies. I was looking for the one where they jump from the ground 30 feet into trees.
That sounds more like the mechanics for 3.5's jump skill.
JUMP (STR; ARMOR CHECK PENALTY)
Use this skill to leap over pits, vault low fences, or reach a tree’s
lowest branches.
Check: The DC and the distance you can cover vary according to
the type of jump you are attempting (see below).
Your Jump check is modified by your speed. If your speed is 30
feet (the speed of an unarmored human), then no modifier based on
speed applies to the check. If your speed is less than 30 feet, you take
a –6 penalty for every 10 feet of speed less than 30 feet. If your speed
is greater than 30 feet, you gain a +4 bonus for every 10 feet beyond
30 feet. For instance, if you have a speed of 20 feet, you take a –6
penalty on your Jump checks. If, on the other hand, your speed is 50
feet, you gain a +8 bonus.
All Jump DCs given here assume that you get a running start,
which requires that you move at least 20 feet in a straight line before
attempting the jump. If you do not get a running start, the DC for
the jump is doubled.
Distance moved by jumping is counted against your normal
maximum movement in a round. For example, Krusk has a speed of
40 feet. If he moves 30 feet, then jumps across a 10-foot-wide chasm,
he’s then moved 40 feet total, so that’s his move action.
If you have ranks in Jump and you succeed on a Jump check, you
land on your feet (when appropriate). If you attempt a Jump check
untrained, you land prone unless you beat the DC by 5 or more.
Long Jump: A long jump is a horizontal jump, made across a gap
like a chasm or stream. At the midpoint of the jump, you attain a
vertical height equal to one-quarter of the horizontal distance. The
DC for the jump is equal to the distance jumped (in feet). For
example, a 10-foot-wide pit requires a DC 10 Jump check to cross.
If your check succeeds, you land on your feet at the far end. If you
fail the check by less than 5, you don’t clear the distance, but you can
make a DC 15 Reflex save to grab the far edge of the gap. You end
your movement grasping the far edge. If that leaves you dangling
over a chasm or gap, getting up requires a move action and a DC 15
Climb check.
Long Jump Distance Jump DC1
5 feet 5
10 feet 10
15 feet 15
20 feet 20
25 feet 25
30 feet 30
1 Requires a 20-foot running start. Without a running start, double the
DC.
High Jump: A high jump is a vertical leap made to reach a ledge
high above or to grasp something overhead, such as a tree limb. The
DC is equal to 4 times the distance to be cleared. For example, the
DC for a high jump to land atop a 3-foot-high ledge is 12 (3 × 4).
If you jumped up to grab something, a successful check indicates
that you reached the desired height. If you wish to pull yourself up,
you can do so with a move action and a DC 15 Climb check. If you
fail the Jump check, you do not reach the height, and you land on
your feet in the same spot from which you jumped. As with a long
jump, the DC is doubled if you do not get a running start of at least
20 feet.
High Jump Distance1 Jump DC2
1 foot 4
2 feet 8
3 feet 12
4 feet 16
5 feet 20
6 feet 24
7 feet 28
8 feet 32
1 Not including vertical reach; see below.
2 Requires a 20-foot running start. Without a running start, double the
DC.
Obviously, the difficulty of reaching a given height varies according
to the size of the character or creature. The maximum vertical reach
(height the creature can reach without jumping) for an average
creature of a given size is shown on the table below. (As a Medium
creature, a typical human can reach 8 feet without jumping.)
Quadrupedal creatures (such as horse) don’t have the same vertical
reach as a bipedal creature; treat them as being one size category
smaller.
Creature Size Vertical Reach
Colossal 128 ft.
Gargantuan 64 ft.
Huge 32 ft.
Large 16 ft.
Medium 8 ft.
Small 4 ft.
Tiny 2 ft.
Diminutive 1 ft.
Fine 1/2 ft.
Hop Up: You can jump up onto an object as tall as your waist, such
as a table or small boulder, with a DC 10 Jump check. Doing so
counts as 10 feet of movement, so if your speed is 30 feet, you could
move 20 feet, then hop up onto a counter. You do not need to get a
running start to hop up, so the DC is not doubled if you do not get a
running start.
Jumping Down: If you intentionally jump from a height, you take
less damage than you would if you just fell. The DC to jump down
from a height is 15. You do not have to get a running start to jump
down, so the DC is not doubled if you do not get a running start.
If you succeed on the check, you take falling damage as if you had
dropped 10 fewer feet than you actually did. Thus, if you jump down
from a height of just 10 feet, you take no damage. If you jump down
from a height of 20 feet, you take damage as if you had fallen 10 feet.
Action: None. A Jump check is included in your movement, so it
is part of a move action. If you run out of movement mid-jump, your
next action (either on this turn or, if necessary, on your next turn)
must be a move action to complete the jump.
Special: Effects that increase your movement also increase your
jumping distance, since your check is modified by your speed.
If you have the Run feat, you get a +4 bonus on Jump checks for
any jumps made after a running start.
A halfling has a +2 racial bonus on Jump checks because halflings
are agile and athletic.
If you have the Acrobatic feat, you get a +2 bonus on Jump
checks.
Synergy: If you have 5 or more ranks in Tumble, you get a +2
bonus on Jump checks.
If you have 5 or more ranks in Jump, you get a +2 bonus on
Tumble checks.
Use this skill to leap over pits, vault low fences, or reach a tree’s
lowest branches.
Check: The DC and the distance you can cover vary according to
the type of jump you are attempting (see below).
Your Jump check is modified by your speed. If your speed is 30
feet (the speed of an unarmored human), then no modifier based on
speed applies to the check. If your speed is less than 30 feet, you take
a –6 penalty for every 10 feet of speed less than 30 feet. If your speed
is greater than 30 feet, you gain a +4 bonus for every 10 feet beyond
30 feet. For instance, if you have a speed of 20 feet, you take a –6
penalty on your Jump checks. If, on the other hand, your speed is 50
feet, you gain a +8 bonus.
All Jump DCs given here assume that you get a running start,
which requires that you move at least 20 feet in a straight line before
attempting the jump. If you do not get a running start, the DC for
the jump is doubled.
Distance moved by jumping is counted against your normal
maximum movement in a round. For example, Krusk has a speed of
40 feet. If he moves 30 feet, then jumps across a 10-foot-wide chasm,
he’s then moved 40 feet total, so that’s his move action.
If you have ranks in Jump and you succeed on a Jump check, you
land on your feet (when appropriate). If you attempt a Jump check
untrained, you land prone unless you beat the DC by 5 or more.
Long Jump: A long jump is a horizontal jump, made across a gap
like a chasm or stream. At the midpoint of the jump, you attain a
vertical height equal to one-quarter of the horizontal distance. The
DC for the jump is equal to the distance jumped (in feet). For
example, a 10-foot-wide pit requires a DC 10 Jump check to cross.
If your check succeeds, you land on your feet at the far end. If you
fail the check by less than 5, you don’t clear the distance, but you can
make a DC 15 Reflex save to grab the far edge of the gap. You end
your movement grasping the far edge. If that leaves you dangling
over a chasm or gap, getting up requires a move action and a DC 15
Climb check.
Long Jump Distance Jump DC1
5 feet 5
10 feet 10
15 feet 15
20 feet 20
25 feet 25
30 feet 30
1 Requires a 20-foot running start. Without a running start, double the
DC.
High Jump: A high jump is a vertical leap made to reach a ledge
high above or to grasp something overhead, such as a tree limb. The
DC is equal to 4 times the distance to be cleared. For example, the
DC for a high jump to land atop a 3-foot-high ledge is 12 (3 × 4).
If you jumped up to grab something, a successful check indicates
that you reached the desired height. If you wish to pull yourself up,
you can do so with a move action and a DC 15 Climb check. If you
fail the Jump check, you do not reach the height, and you land on
your feet in the same spot from which you jumped. As with a long
jump, the DC is doubled if you do not get a running start of at least
20 feet.
High Jump Distance1 Jump DC2
1 foot 4
2 feet 8
3 feet 12
4 feet 16
5 feet 20
6 feet 24
7 feet 28
8 feet 32
1 Not including vertical reach; see below.
2 Requires a 20-foot running start. Without a running start, double the
DC.
Obviously, the difficulty of reaching a given height varies according
to the size of the character or creature. The maximum vertical reach
(height the creature can reach without jumping) for an average
creature of a given size is shown on the table below. (As a Medium
creature, a typical human can reach 8 feet without jumping.)
Quadrupedal creatures (such as horse) don’t have the same vertical
reach as a bipedal creature; treat them as being one size category
smaller.
Creature Size Vertical Reach
Colossal 128 ft.
Gargantuan 64 ft.
Huge 32 ft.
Large 16 ft.
Medium 8 ft.
Small 4 ft.
Tiny 2 ft.
Diminutive 1 ft.
Fine 1/2 ft.
Hop Up: You can jump up onto an object as tall as your waist, such
as a table or small boulder, with a DC 10 Jump check. Doing so
counts as 10 feet of movement, so if your speed is 30 feet, you could
move 20 feet, then hop up onto a counter. You do not need to get a
running start to hop up, so the DC is not doubled if you do not get a
running start.
Jumping Down: If you intentionally jump from a height, you take
less damage than you would if you just fell. The DC to jump down
from a height is 15. You do not have to get a running start to jump
down, so the DC is not doubled if you do not get a running start.
If you succeed on the check, you take falling damage as if you had
dropped 10 fewer feet than you actually did. Thus, if you jump down
from a height of just 10 feet, you take no damage. If you jump down
from a height of 20 feet, you take damage as if you had fallen 10 feet.
Action: None. A Jump check is included in your movement, so it
is part of a move action. If you run out of movement mid-jump, your
next action (either on this turn or, if necessary, on your next turn)
must be a move action to complete the jump.
Special: Effects that increase your movement also increase your
jumping distance, since your check is modified by your speed.
If you have the Run feat, you get a +4 bonus on Jump checks for
any jumps made after a running start.
A halfling has a +2 racial bonus on Jump checks because halflings
are agile and athletic.
If you have the Acrobatic feat, you get a +2 bonus on Jump
checks.
Synergy: If you have 5 or more ranks in Tumble, you get a +2
bonus on Jump checks.
If you have 5 or more ranks in Jump, you get a +2 bonus on
Tumble checks.
LongJump. When you make a long jump, you cover a
number of feet up to your Strength score if you move at
least 10 feet on foot immediately before the jump. When
you make a standing long jump, you can leap only half
that distance. Either way, each foot you clear on the
jum p costs a foot of movement.
This rule assumes that the height of your jump
doesn’t matter, such as a jump across a stream or
chasm. At your DM ’s option, you must succeed on a
DC 10 Strength (Athletics) check to clear a low obstacle
(no taller than a quarter of the jump’s distance), such as
a hedge or low wall. Otherwise, you hit it.
W hen you land in difficult terrain, you must succeed
on a DC 10 Dexterity (Acrobatics) check to land on your
feet. Otherwise, you land prone.
High Jump. W hen you make a high jump, you leap
into the air a number of feet equal to 3 + your Strength
m odifier if you move at least 10 feet on foot immediately
before the jump. W hen you make a standing high jump,
you can jump only half that distance. Either way, each
foot you clear on the jump costs a foot o f movement. In
some circumstances, your DM might allow you to make
a Strength (Athletics) check to jump higher than you
normally can.
You can extend your arms half your height above
yourself during the jump. Thus, you can reach above
you a distance equal to the height of the jump plus 1 1/2
times your height.
number of feet up to your Strength score if you move at
least 10 feet on foot immediately before the jump. When
you make a standing long jump, you can leap only half
that distance. Either way, each foot you clear on the
jum p costs a foot of movement.
This rule assumes that the height of your jump
doesn’t matter, such as a jump across a stream or
chasm. At your DM ’s option, you must succeed on a
DC 10 Strength (Athletics) check to clear a low obstacle
(no taller than a quarter of the jump’s distance), such as
a hedge or low wall. Otherwise, you hit it.
W hen you land in difficult terrain, you must succeed
on a DC 10 Dexterity (Acrobatics) check to land on your
feet. Otherwise, you land prone.
High Jump. W hen you make a high jump, you leap
into the air a number of feet equal to 3 + your Strength
m odifier if you move at least 10 feet on foot immediately
before the jump. W hen you make a standing high jump,
you can jump only half that distance. Either way, each
foot you clear on the jump costs a foot o f movement. In
some circumstances, your DM might allow you to make
a Strength (Athletics) check to jump higher than you
normally can.
You can extend your arms half your height above
yourself during the jump. Thus, you can reach above
you a distance equal to the height of the jump plus 1 1/2
times your height.
Last edited:
Vikingkingq
Adventurer
I don't agree. 3.5 Jump was a Strength skill not a Dex skill.
And Dex only applies to jumping in 5e if you land on rough terrain.
And Dex only applies to jumping in 5e if you land on rough terrain.
Or if you tumble through a space occupied by an enemy, or to improve you AC to avoid being hit by an opportunity attack.
Jumping to rough terrain like the other side of a riverbank is quite a bit more common than the dungeon crawl edge case of needing to jump and clear a low obstacle no taller than a quarter of the jump's distance. Even in a dungeon crawl that's an edge case situation
I feel like people are massively overplaying what dmg272 says for the tumble thing
OVERRUN
When a creature tries to move through a hostile
creature's space, the mover can try to force its way
through by overrunning the hostile creature. As an
action or a bonus action, the mover makes a Strength
Athletics) check contested by the hostile creature's
Strength (Athletics) check. The creature attempting the
overrun has advantage on this check if it is larger than
the hostile creature, or disadvantage if it is smaller. If
the mover wins the contest, it can move through the
hostile creature's space once this turn.
SHOVE ASIDE
With this option, a creature uses the special shove
attack from the Player's Handbook to force a target
to the side, rather than away. The attacker has
disadvantage on its Strength (Athletics) check when it
does so. If that check is successful, the attacker moves
the target 5 feet to a different space within its reach.
TUMBLE
A creature can try to tumble through a hostile creature's
space, ducking and weaving past the opponent. As an
action or a bonus action, the tumbler makes a Dexterity
(Acrobatics) check contested by the hostile creature's
Dexterity (Acrobatics) check. If the tumbler wins the
contest, it can move through the hostile creature's space
once this turn.
When a creature tries to move through a hostile
creature's space, the mover can try to force its way
through by overrunning the hostile creature. As an
action or a bonus action, the mover makes a Strength
Athletics) check contested by the hostile creature's
Strength (Athletics) check. The creature attempting the
overrun has advantage on this check if it is larger than
the hostile creature, or disadvantage if it is smaller. If
the mover wins the contest, it can move through the
hostile creature's space once this turn.
SHOVE ASIDE
With this option, a creature uses the special shove
attack from the Player's Handbook to force a target
to the side, rather than away. The attacker has
disadvantage on its Strength (Athletics) check when it
does so. If that check is successful, the attacker moves
the target 5 feet to a different space within its reach.
TUMBLE
A creature can try to tumble through a hostile creature's
space, ducking and weaving past the opponent. As an
action or a bonus action, the tumbler makes a Dexterity
(Acrobatics) check contested by the hostile creature's
Dexterity (Acrobatics) check. If the tumbler wins the
contest, it can move through the hostile creature's space
once this turn.
If you don't have that defensive line style lineup someone could literally just walk dash or even dash+cunning action dash+etc in circles around the creature they want to tumble through.
All three of them are elements of past editions stripped of a reason to exist & pasted from the cutting room floor to the dmg.
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