Stat requirements

[Storm Raven]

Says you. It totally depends on how a person defines levelling up. If you can do it between a move action and a standard action, however, then it's an in-game action.

No, it isn't. It is not a defined action. It does not take a move action, standard action, free action, or swift action to do. It is a non-action. It is an event, but not an in-game action.

 

[Infiniti2000]

I missed the bit where you told Hyp that before I posted, sorry about that. I'd probably house-rule the Complete Warrior bit in, to prevent the madness that is "the letter of the rules". Otherwise I'd have human wizards casting polymorph to get into the Arcane Archer prestige class and low-int wizards jumping into Archmage.

Actually, I allow the CW as source, but choose not to use CW16. That's okay, though, since (in short) I choose not to allow temporary effects to affect character level-up decision. I.e. if a fighter has a STR 16 and is currently drained to 11, and somehow a level up occurs during that timespan, he can choose power attack. In addition, an arcane archer polymorphed into an ogre (or whatever) can still imbue an arrow. A dwarven defender reincarnated as a halfling can still use defensive stance. From a flavor perspective, if I may, this is at least as interesting as the big bad item previously mentioned. From a game mechanic perspective, I'd argue that it's far simpler.

(snip example) Bob is left scratching his head in confusion over the apparent randomness of your calls.

Bob knows beforehand how I choose to adjudicate levelling up. It is neither random nor against the rules. Some may consider it a houserule, but I don't. Also, I am clear to point out that the contrary interpretation are not houserules.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Note the use of the term "activating", and not "casting". Note that using a scroll "is like casting a spell", which is different from "is casting a spell". There is exactly one reference to "casting" the spell, and 8 to the spell being "activated" or "used".

I disagree about the "exactly one reference." You are not being honest about this. Besides the one from the only section you quoted, we have from the definition of spell completion item: "...all the user need do to cast the spell...." It doesn't get much plainer than that. Oh, wait, it does. In the UMD section which you selectively ignored. There are other places, but even just one instance is sufficient.

 

[Infiniti2000]

No, it isn't. It is not a defined action. It does not take a move action, standard action, free action, or swift action to do. It is a non-action. It is an event, but not an in-game action.

Well, see, you're working to defend my stance. I appreciate it, but I thought you were on the other side of the argument. If it's not an in-game action, how can a character choose to do it in-game? Realize that I'm not proposing my position, I'm trying to give you the opposing viewpoint.

 

[IcyCool]

Also, I am clear to point out that the contrary interpretation are not houserules.

And I am not clear to argue the point, as per the clarification on how we are to behave in the forum.

So, suffice it to say, I read "Prerequisites: Int 13" and "To learn, prepare, or cast a spell, a wizard must have an Intelligence score equal to at least 10 + the spell level" to mean "You must have a 13 Int" to take the feat, and "You must have at least 13 Int" to cast 3rd level wizard spells. A wizard with 12 Int who puts on a Headband of Intellect +2 fulfills these requirements. There is nothing in the text that says otherwise, as far as I can see.

 

[Twowolves]

Seems as though there should be a distinction between "gaining" a feat and "using" a feat.

And every arguement about losing the ability to use a feat due to no longer having the prerequisite stat score is ignoring the fact that Abililty DAMAGE is intrinsicly transient. Saying "you can't take Power Attack today because a shadow may drain your Str below 13 tomorrow" is a straw man arguement. Every instance in the rules detailing the loss of the use of a feat is an example of Ability Damage (a negative modifier) and not the removal of a spell or piece of gear (removal of a positive modifier).

 

[Hypersmurf]

If it's not an in-game action, how can a character choose to do it in-game?

Is the Luck Domain special ability (reroll 1/day) an in-game action? Is the character aware that it can be used only once per day? Does he know that it has been used for the day, when it is used?

-Hyp.

 

[Infiniti2000]

And I am not clear to argue the point, as per the clarification on how we are to behave in the forum.

I'm not sure what you mean, but I assure you I meant nothing bad by my statement. I was not trying to be sarcastic or anything. I was being serious in that both sides are valid.

So, suffice it to say, I read "Prerequisites: Int 13" and "To learn, prepare, or cast a spell, a wizard must have an Intelligence score equal to at least 10 + the spell level" to mean "You must have a 13 Int" to take the feat, and "You must have at least 13 Int" to cast 3rd level wizard spells. A wizard with 12 Int who puts on a Headband of Intellect +2 fulfills these requirements. There is nothing in the text that says otherwise, as far as I can see.

Okay. Now explain how in those two examples those things are used. In one case, the wizard sleeps (in game), wakes up (hopefully in game ), and prepares his spells (in game). All of these have clear rules on how long it takes and what is expected of the wizard character. In the other case, what? The wizard character (not player) does what exactly to gain the feat? Can he put on the headband and mutter a prayer to Boccob to raise his level?

Do you understand the difference?

 

[Infiniti2000]

Is the Luck Domain special ability (reroll 1/day) an in-game action? Is the character aware that it can be used only once per day? Does he know that it has been used for the day, when it is used?

-Hyp.

I bet you had to search your brain for that one.

But yes, it most certainly is an in game action. Specifically, it's identified as an extraordinary ability, not supernatural or spell-like. It says "Using an extraordinary ability is usually not an action because most extraordinary abilities automatically happen in a reactive fashion." So, the luck domain ability is not an action, though it's obviously an in game "action" that the character takes. The rules on adjudicating it are clear.

 

[Storm Raven]

Well, see, you're working to defend my stance. I appreciate it, but I thought you were on the other side of the argument. If it's not an in-game action, how can a character choose to do it in-game? Realize that I'm not proposing my position, I'm trying to give you the opposing viewpoint.

It is an in-game event, but not an in-game action.