D&D General Talking about Stepping Away from D&D?

[Umbran]

Just be honest and explain to them that you are an emotionally stunted child who gets upset when adults threaten to take you toys away

Mod Note:
But insulting people on the internet is the act of a mature adult?

You are done in this conversation.

 

[Oofta]

So back towards the end of 4E, I was burning out and just wasn't having much fun running the game any more. So I just explained how I felt to my group and that after we wrapped up the current campaign that we'd figure out something else. As it turned out, that something else was 5E that was announced shortly after the talk. But my point is that I just explained to the group what was going on, what I was feeling and that I wanted to move on...and they were okay with it.

But speaking of the OGL controversy, that to me might be a bit of a red herring. Maybe. If someone in my life made a mistake and, before there was any actual harm done, apologized and went out of their way to make things better I would forgive them. Life is to short to hold grudges or get too bent out of shape because someone f'ed up, nobody is perfect. I know I'm certainly not and have made plenty of mistakes in the past. I view WOTC's f-up the same way. They screwed up but then in short order (for a corporation anyway) made it right.

I'm not telling you what to think or feel, whether or not I agree or even understand. I just think you need to think about what the real root cause is. Is it frustration with the rules? The genre? Just burning out on being a DM? Because that will determine how you should handle it.

 

[billd91]

I might be misunderstanding the last part….fans of how the OGL has affected the 3pp market over the last 20 years. What’s the viewpoint of the con of the OGL for 3pp being able to make products ad nauseam since 3e?

I can't speak for them for certain, but I know they're active with other games more than D&D since before the OGL appeared. I don't think they were very chuffed by the glut of 3e materials, the collapse when WotC put out 3.5, and the way OGL materials still tend to crowd other games out of the game stores or on convention vendor floors. I'm not sure I agree with their points since I've been a fan of some of the OGL producers and products from Paizo, Kobold Press, and others. But I can see the argument.

 

[Retreater]

I'm not telling you what to think or feel, whether or not I agree or even understand. I just think you need to think about what the real root cause is. Is it frustration with the rules? The genre? Just burning out on being a DM? Because that will determine how you should handle it.

I think I'm (perhaps irrationally) upset that I perceive the company is being run by people who truly don't care about the hobby or its longevity and that they are sending messages that are outright lies.
[Honestly, I was feeling better about the whole thing after the Creative Commons arrangement. I was cool with forging ahead with non-WotC 5e - until Kyle Brink started the goodwill tour. I feel like he's lying to the entire community.]
Prior to all this, I still didn't consider 5e my favorite game, but it was still ok to run - especially for new or casual players.
Now I want my players to see that there are companies who actually care that they play their system, companies that aren't trying to monetize us to become $1B lifestyle brands. Of course I'm only a DM, but I'd like to encourage them to stand up for small businesses - in the same way I'd recommend them to shop at a FLGS instead of Amazon. Because this is important to the hobby, and they are the future of it. The entire OGL fiasco was frightening because it showed what could happen if one company became a monolith in the hobby.
I want them to learn that they should stand up and make their voices heard. In twenty years, we'll need them if this happens again. And it will serve them well to learn this lesson - because even though it's just a hobby game this time - we should always be ready to stand up against tyrants.

 

[Scribe]

I think I'm (perhaps irrationally) upset that I perceive the company is being run by people who truly don't care about the hobby or its longevity and that they are sending messages that are outright lies.
[Honestly, I was feeling better about the whole thing after the Creative Commons arrangement. I was cool with forging ahead with non-WotC 5e - until Kyle Brink started the goodwill tour. I feel like he's lying to the entire community.]
Prior to all this, I still didn't consider 5e my favorite game, but it was still ok to run - especially for new or casual players.
Now I want my players to see that there are companies who actually care that they play their system, companies that aren't trying to monetize us to become $1B lifestyle brands. Of course I'm only a DM, but I'd like to encourage them to stand up for small businesses - in the same way I'd recommend them to shop at a FLGS instead of Amazon. Because this is important to the hobby, and they are the future of it. The entire OGL fiasco was frightening because it showed what could happen if one company became a monolith in the hobby.
I want them to learn that they should stand up and make their voices heard. In twenty years, we'll need them if this happens again. And it will serve them well to learn this lesson - because even though it's just a hobby game this time - we should always be ready to stand up against tyrants.

My 2 cents is, you cannot do this by walking away.

What you can do, is have a discussion about it. I dont know the ages of your players, but what you are talking about here is more than just RPGs, its consumerism in general and yeah, getting people to try and support local is a worthwhile discussion.

I'd just have a discussion and say 'this is how I feel about things, and why its important to me' and go from there. I'd schedule time outside of the 'game night' to do so as well.

 

[Hex08]

Have any of you had "the talk" at your table?
My players don't follow the news and likely know nothing (and care nothing) about the situation. But I'm running two weekly 5e games, and I'm not feeling it anymore.
I don't want to look at the books. I don't want to go with the group to watch the movie together. I don't want to drink from my D&D Tumbler. I don't want this brand in my life.
I'm wondering how the discussion might go. How do I address that I want to stop playing their favorite game because of some idealogical dispute with a corporation? How do I frame this in a way so we can all keep having fun without me looking even more dishevelled than usual?

Maybe I'm lucky because my group are all good friends but when I feel like switching it up I tell them I need to try something new out to keep my interest up and no one disagrees. I used to present them with a few different games to get their feedback but it always came down to "whatever you want to run" so now I just tell then way in advance what game I am moving to and give them a chance to say if they don't like the sound of it. Occasionally (rarely, actually) I have had a player say they don't like the game once we have started and when I that happens I poll everyone about how they feel about the current game without giving up the dissenter. If all or most were to have the same opinion I would drop the game then (this has never happened). If it's only the one player I will finish the campaign but trim off as much fat as possible to complete the story as quickly as possible to move onto something else, this gets the player not having fun out of the game as soon as possible without ruining the story for everyone else. Once, when I was finally burned out on Pathfinder 1E one of my better players stepped up to DM for the first time and he took over that game and we switch off GM duties.

As for the ideological dispute, if they don't follow the hobby that closely (my players don't either) then I wouldn't bring it up. Just tell them you are burnt out and need a change or if you want to avoid the topic of burn out them just start talking up some other games that caught your interest to gauge their response it and if they seem interested in any you have your "in" to switch games after the current story is done. With the wide variety of games available you would have to have some really stubborn players to not be able to find a different game that everyone can enjoy.

Also, personally, I would ignore the "get over it" advise being presented, it just doesn't seem helpful to your situation. If you aren't enjoying the game anymore it's a safe bet that your players will eventually pick up on that. Maybe it will come to that if no one is willing to change and you want to keep the neighborhood group together but there is no harm in slowly broaching the subject as I mentioned above to gage response.

 

[Hex08]

That's possible.
In the case of one group I'm getting increasingly frustrated and bored. I've also tried other systems to shake it up, but it hasn't solved the underlying problem.
So for that group, I'm planning on one or two more sessions to end it with a suitable climax to the campaign. And then I'm on holiday. (I've been running for them weekly for 3 years.)
The other group is my in-person group with the neighborhood teens and families. I've been running for them for only about 5 months, and it's been delightful (the dragon folding boat incident, notwithstanding - even if that managed to be memorable).
And honestly, it's the neighborhood group I'm most worried about disappointing. We're fostering a teenager who desperately needs this positive interaction with his peers. My wife is having a blast.
I was planning adventures to get us to 15th level and had a second 5e campaign ready to go after that.
That group finds so much joy in the experience, and they're not jaded. They'd probably have a great time even playing an adventure I've rated 1-star.
But I hate seeing the WotC stuff. They're loving the game so much they're buying merch and wearing it to the game, telling their friends how great "D&D" is - and I find myself wishing I could redirect that enthusiasm to another game.

Like I think someone else mentioned, break it up with some short adventures in different systems. They may love D&D but I think you will be surprised how willing to adapt people are. When I started playing D&D in the early 1980's TSR was releasing other RPGs - Top Secret, Boot Hill, Star Frontiers, Gamma World, etc - plus there were games from other companies. We loved D&D but effortlessly jumped between games almost from the start.

 

[Oofta]

I think I'm (perhaps irrationally) upset that I perceive the company is being run by people who truly don't care about the hobby or its longevity and that they are sending messages that are outright lies.
[Honestly, I was feeling better about the whole thing after the Creative Commons arrangement. I was cool with forging ahead with non-WotC 5e - until Kyle Brink started the goodwill tour. I feel like he's lying to the entire community.]
Prior to all this, I still didn't consider 5e my favorite game, but it was still ok to run - especially for new or casual players.
Now I want my players to see that there are companies who actually care that they play their system, companies that aren't trying to monetize us to become $1B lifestyle brands. Of course I'm only a DM, but I'd like to encourage them to stand up for small businesses - in the same way I'd recommend them to shop at a FLGS instead of Amazon. Because this is important to the hobby, and they are the future of it. The entire OGL fiasco was frightening because it showed what could happen if one company became a monolith in the hobby.
I want them to learn that they should stand up and make their voices heard. In twenty years, we'll need them if this happens again. And it will serve them well to learn this lesson - because even though it's just a hobby game this time - we should always be ready to stand up against tyrants.

Not to belabor the point, but we don't know who was behind the [edit] OGL 1.1[/edit] whether it was really meant for release, what the motivation and thought process was.

All we really know is that they backed off and went beyond what was necessary. So while, again, I'm not telling you what to do or feel, I do think it's worth thinking about what kind of lesson you're teaching. Because it could sound like you're teaching that if you screw up, even if no real damage was done and you go above and beyond to make it right, that there can be no forgiveness.

That and I don't assume any company of any size truly has my best interests at heart. Some individuals in the company may, and I think some WOTC employees care deeply. But the company? Nah. They just want to make money.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Like I think someone else mentioned, break it up with some short adventures in different systems. They may love D&D but I think you will be surprised how willing to adapt people are. When I started playing D&D in the early 1980's TSR was releasing other RPGs - Top Secret, Boot Hill, Star Frontiers, Gamms World, etc - plus there were games from other companies. We loved D&D but effortlessly jumped between games almost from the start.

This. I've always played a variety of RPG systems. I don't know how you can do otherwise without getting bored after a while. I'm resting from D&D when my current campaign finishes, not because some senior manager at WotC screwed up*, but because I've played it for about 5 years, and that's plenty.


*"Why did you do that?" Said the frog to the scorpion. "Now we will both drown". "Because it's my nature", replied the scorpion.

 

[Retreater]

Not to belabor the point, but we don't know who was behind the OGL 1.2, whether it was really meant for release, what the motivation and thought process was.

Wasn't 1.2 the one they had the survey to review? Are we talking about 1.1 (which was the really "draconian" one)?

Because it could sound like you're teaching that if you screw up, even if no real damage was done and you go above and beyond to make it right, that there can be no forgiveness.

I want them to stop lying to me. I was basically okay with everything after the Creative Commons solution. It is Kyle Brink that is pushing me over the edge now.