D&D (2024) Why No Monster Creation Rules in D&D 2024?

[Oofta]

I'm dissapointed that we don't have rules, I hoped we would. On the other hand a couple of observations.

First is that these books seem to be targeted to people who have never played before or have had only minimal experience. For brand new DMs, you probably don't need or want to start making new monsters right off the bat. If you include rules for making monsters it can give the false impression that making custom monsters is kind of a default, something everyone who wants to be a good DM should do.

The other is that I've always made custom monsters since long before we had any monster building rules or guidelines. IIRC they show up first in the 2012 DMG, at least as part of core set of rules. I always just grabbed an existing monster or two that were close enough and modified them to be what I wanted. We never needed a set of rules to make custom monsters.

I still wish they have provided the rules and other than being emphasizing what is required for new DMs, I don't have an answer. It would have been nice to have them but I'm also sure that in a short period of time someone will have reverse engineered them to come up with some guidelines.

 

[Blue]

Because monster creation is an art, not a science. The only rule is there are no rules.

Looking at other D&D-like RPGs such as 13th Age, we can see that you can give strong guides to monster creating. Just like one can learn how to paint, the "art" of monster design to fit in with math expectations and existing monsters is better with guidance. The idea "The only rule is there are no rules" is demonstrable false.

 

[delericho]

I think a better question would be why not have a monster creation system (which you can include in the monster or DM book) and actually use that system to create all the monsters in your monster book?

This way, players can reverse-engineer the monsters you present to see how the system work and then use it to alter those monsters or create their own.

In other words, make it a science and not an art.

I don't think you can turn it into a science - what looks like it should work on paper just doesn't always work in reality. Either the monsters just become too formulaic or the system throws up weird results. There will always need to be some scope for adjusting and tweaking to turn something that system says is about right into something that is actually right.

That said, it's also not the case that there's no system to it. So failing to address this topic is another weakness of the 2024 revision.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I am curious if the designers have said, in blog posts or videos or whatever, why precisely they decided to not include full monster design rules in the 2024 DMG or MM? (And no, the DMG "rules" presented are not what I am talking about.)

Is it because they are going to appear somewhere else later? Or is there no actual system behind it all? Or is there a system but the team doesn't think DMs can handle it?

If there is no word from the designers or WotC as a whole, what do you think the reason is?

I would never expect them to answer that question unless forced. There's no way to make them look good with it unless they claim that's what the players wanted.

 

[T4lkingSKU-11]

I hope that we get revised monster creation rules at some point. Tweaking stat blocks is fine up to a certain point, but when you need something unique it gets a bit harder to judge how strong to actually make it.

 

[Micah Sweet]

yeah.

the page count argument irritates me because monster creation rules took up 10 pages in 2014. In 2024 they used 40 pages for the planes. Frankly, monster creation rules are far more useful than planes that may or may not exist in any individual campaign.

But the planes feature their IP. You gotta think like a mega-corporation!

 

[Micah Sweet]

I think a better question would be why not have a monster creation system (which you can include in the monster or DM book) and actually use that system to create all the monsters in your monster book?

This way, players can reverse-engineer the monsters you present to see how the system work and then use it to alter those monsters or create their own.

In other words, make it a science and not an art.

An excellent idea, and one that several games and designers I admire for their work use! Shame WotC isn't one of them.

 

[CreamCloud0]

given that there are principles like the golden ratio, warm/cold tones and complementary/contrasting colours even within art there can be guidelines that can be used to structure your design, rather than let people just guess at the process.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Well, I’d say there are some very good reasons not to do that. The main two being that monsters might end up feeling extremely formulaic and therefore boring, and more importantly, that there are really too many variables in play for such a formula to work reliably anyway. Better to use the formula as a starting point, playtest, and use actual in-play experience to inform further iteration and refinement. That goes for homebrewers as well as for professional designers.

Disagree. You're basically saying it's too hard. It can and has been done with good results, you just have to put the effort in to make the best system you can, with plenty of options and a solid frame.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I'm dissapointed that we don't have rules, I hoped we would. On the other hand a couple of observations.

First is that these books seem to be targeted to people who have never played before or have had only minimal experience. For brand new DMs, you probably don't need or want to start making new monsters right off the bat. If you include rules for making monsters it can give the false impression that making custom monsters is kind of a default, something everyone who wants to be a good DM should do.

The other is that I've always made custom monsters since long before we had any monster building rules or guidelines. IIRC they show up first in the 2012 DMG, at least as part of core set of rules. I always just grabbed an existing monster or two that were close enough and modified them to be what I wanted. We never needed a set of rules to make custom monsters.

I still wish they have provided the rules and other than being emphasizing what is required for new DMs, I don't have an answer. It would have been nice to have them but I'm also sure that in a short period of time someone will have reverse engineered them to come up with some guidelines.

I don't believe anyone is saying we need monster creation rules. But they would be very helpful to some folks, emphasize D&D as a toolkit (a very appealing idea to some) and removing them in 5.5 literally takes something away that the game used to have. They've done that in several places lately, so I think irritation is warranted, even if you don't care or feel it is valuable personally.