TSR Now it’s WotC’s Turn: WotC Moves Against TSR3

I guess after you provoke somebody enough, they’ll eventually bite back. The company has begun trademark cancellation procedures against the newest TSR.

TSR3 briefly filed for a court declaration on Dec 7th as to their ownership of the TSR trademarks — with an IndieGoGo campaign to fund it — and then voluntarily dismissed it a couple of days later on Dec 9th.

This filing is dated Dec 6th, the day before TSR3 launched its campaign.

In WotC’s response, they cite fraud as one of the causes of action, alleging that TSR3 misled the trademark office in its original application.

Mike Dunford, on Twitter, breaks down the action.

TSR - TSR3.5 Voluntarily Dismisses Lawsuit

A lawsuit filed by TSR3 against D&D owners Wizards of the Coast a few days ago was voluntarily dismissed. Dismissal without prejudice means that the suit can be filed again. The suit lasted two days from the 7th to the 9th of December. The IndieGoGo fundraiser to fund it is still running...

www.enworld.org

TSR - TSR3.5 Launches IndieGogo Campaign to "Stop" WotC

The latest in the TSR3 saga, which has gone quiet for a while, is a new IndieGoGo campaign launched to "stop Wizards of the Coast". They cite wrongful bullying of TSR, and refusal to answer requests that WotC show TSR "proof of their claims" (although the campaign page doesn't mention what those...

www.enworld.org

 

[Maggan]

and I prefer to keep my memories of TSR from when I was a kid as isolated from their nonsense as much as possible.

Yeah, this does not in any way change my feelings for True TSR.

This nuTSR is a spectre, a beast wearing the vestiges of times past and a deceitful changeling.

TSR of old, warts and all, will still be TSR to me. No shenanigans from people who are a decade or more younger than me will change that.

They weren't there.

Well Ernie was, but I believe him to be a puppet on a string, an alibi for the shadow-players.

 

[Azzy]

I spent a not insignificant amount of my teenage years dancing in goth clubs to The Ubiquitous Mr. Lovegrove as the fog machine blasted, mixing with the smell of clove cigarettes.

You and me both.

 

[Dausuul]

I spent a not insignificant amount of my teenage years dancing in goth clubs to The Ubiquitous Mr. Lovegrove as the fog machine blasted, mixing with the smell of clove cigarettes.

The first CD I ever owned was "In the Realm of a Dying Sun." I listened to that so many times. I still include a forest named "the Forest of Veils" in half my campaign worlds.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

Yeah, their claims that they're the same TSR ring absolutely hollow. And hopefully, they won't be able to do that anymore soon.

Yeah, this does not in any way change my feelings for True TSR.

This nuTSR is a spectre, a beast wearing the vestiges of times past and a deceitful changeling.

TSR of old, warts and all, will still be TSR to me. No shenanigans from people who are a decade or more younger than me will change that.

They weren't there.

Well Ernie was, but I believe him to be a puppet on a string, an alibi for the shadow-players.

Ah, while I'll take the wisdom of age (or at least, what little I've managed to scavenge!), I fondly remember those days.

You and me both.

Nice. 4AD's catalog is just amazing. People don't seem to talk as much about that record label and its influence anymore, but they should.

The first CD I ever owned was "In the Realm of a Dying Sun." I listened to that so many times. I still include a forest named "the Forest of Veils" in half my campaign worlds.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Yeah, their claims that they're the same TSR ring absolutely hollow. And hopefully, they won't be able to do that anymore soon.

It started when they were still partnered with Dinehart and Giantlands. They were working with Ward and Elmore, who were part of the original TSR, so they tried to milk that for all it was worth. When Dinehart left (taking Ward and Elmore with him), LaNasa didn't change his pitch, and still is trying to say they are the same by association--an association that no longer exists.

The only ties to the original TSR they have left is opening the DHSM in Gygax's house, and still working with Ernie. Tenuous at best, but they are trying really hard to make any connection to the original TSR, because that's key to their entire business plan. Without TSR branding, they are just another indie OSR publisher. Check that, they haven't even published anything. They are wannabes.

 

[Mannahnin]

Well, to my understanding they exaggerated or lied about the original TSR creatives from the start.

LaNasa claimed to an interviewer that Tim Kask was on board, and stated publicly multiple times that they had several such people.

Even Jim Ward and Larry Elmore were work for hire on the Giantlands project, which predated TSR(3)'s existence, and when TSR(3) was first announced, someone asked Jim about TSR(3) and he had no idea it existed. Similar with Jeff Dee, who Justin commissioned in 2020 to do some art for Tots & Tales and apparently was going to be used for some more freelance work, but distanced himself once the PR dumpster fire started this Summer.

The few original TSR creatives they had any connection with were always freelancers, not even aware that TSR(3) was trying to claim to be TSR Reborn until after that marketing strategy was launched. TSR(3) never really had any original TSR folks as part of the company, though they repeatedly claimed so.

 

[Stormonu]

At the end of the day, TSR is as dead to me as Atari, Radio Shack, Toys’R’Us and Sears. They may come back as ghosts of the past, but they’re just bits of undigested beef - with more of a gravy about them than the grave (to butcher a Christmas Carol quote).

 

[Sacrosanct]

but distanced himself once the PR dumpster fire started this Summer.

That's putting it mildly lol. He was...pretty adamant about his distaste for LaNasa and crew, refusing to take any money from them. Jeff is a good guy, and put his ethics above profit. I don't want to speak for him, naturally, but I bet part of him wishes he never did work for them in the past, based on what I know of him.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

That they're even an actual indie OSR publisher is tenuous at best!

I remember thinking that the Dungeon Hobby Shop Museum was a cool idea, before I knew what horrible people and grifters the people involved were. Had they stuck to that and kept their mouths shut, I'd probably be planning on visiting it this coming Gary Con. Now it feels like the lair of a bunch of loathsome con artists squatting on a historic site.

It started when they were still partnered with Dinehart and Giantlands. They were working with Ward and Elmore, who were part of the original TSR, so they tried to milk that for all it was worth. When Dinehart left (taking Ward and Elmore with him), LaNasa didn't change his pitch, and still is trying to say they are the same by association--an association that no longer exists.

The only ties to the original TSR they have left is opening the DHSM in Gygax's house, and still working with Ernie. Tenuous at best, but they are trying really hard to make any connection to the original TSR, because that's key to their entire business plan. Without TSR branding, they are just another indie OSR publisher. Check that, they haven't even published anything. They are wannabes.

That's the thing, those companies were great in their time. But you can't bring them back because who we were back then can't be brought back, nor can the world they existed in. As a musician, I was always popping into Radio Shack for some bits and bobs of electronical junk. Atari made some absolutely bangers, but the entire technological landscape has changed so dramatically.* I can go online and get the most obscure electronic components at the click of a button. Videogames have advanced lightyears, technologically and conceptually.

*Some of their old games still hold up, granted. Missile Command is about as action-packed as you could ask for, with a bleak narrative that speaks so eloquently to the fears of the era it was created in; I still regularly play it.

At the end of the day, TSR is as dead to me as Atari, Radio Shack, Toys’R’Us and Sears. They may come back as ghosts of the past, but they’re just bits of undigested beef - with more of a gravy about them than the grave (to butcher a Christmas Carol quote).

 

[Stormonu]

*Some of their old games still hold up, granted. Missile Command is about as action-packed as you could ask for, with a bleak narrative that speaks so eloquently to the fears of the era it was created in; I still regularly play it.

PAC-man is my game (though I’m not overly good at it) - if an electronic gadget I buy can’t run some version of it, it’s junk to me.

Funnily enough, each one of those places I named above I acquired something D&D related from; The gold boxes from Radio Shack, my 1E PHB/DMG/UA from Toys’R’Us, Intellivision D&D from Sears, and Adventure from Atari, and of course the original TSR…

What do these bums have to offer?