D&D 5E Honor Among Thieves Character Stats

D&D Beyond has published the official game statistics for various characters from the upcoming D&D: Honor Among Thieves movie.

The collection includes stats for Doric, Edgin Darvis, Forge Fitzwilliam, Holga Kilgore, Simon Aumar, Sofina, and Xenk Yendar.

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Sacrosanct

Legend
I think it's a mistake for anyone to look at this and take them too seriously. They are meant to be fun, and a bit of nice thing to have, similar to how when the D&D cartoon came out in a boxed set, there where character sheets included. Anyone looking to take these too seriously is going to be disappointed.

Also, the junior novelization of the movie calls out Simon's heritage too (as well as his failed wooing of Doric).
 

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Clint_L

Hero
It doesn't because these "sheets" aren't really character sheets, they're monster stat blocks so anything goes.

Except for magic, cause caster type monsters are nerfed heavily in 5e now no thanks to that Mordenkainen Multiverse books
Agree. As a DM, I hate that spell lists are removed from spellcasters. Hate it with a passion. It hugely dumbs down their tactical options and makes them way less interesting to run and challenging to fight. The worst offender of this new breed of stat block is the new version of Vecna, who is now barely a wizard and more a teleporting stabby guy.

This is simplification gone too far, for me.
 

Stormonu

Legend
I’m mixed on the abbreviated spellcasters. In an active encounter, it makes them easy to run, but I’d like the option presented to use full-blown spellcasting. Like demon summoning, I‘d like to see them present a “suggested“ spell list in a green note block for dedicated casters for extended use bad guys and such.
 

Whizbang Dustyboots

Gnometown Hero
Nah that was a nightmare as a GM, loads of points stuff you were meant to do to follow character rules, and most of it would never actually come up in play. As it meant any ability you gave to a NPC you also had to allow players to get somehow, which causes all sorts of problems. You big bad needs to be able to fight four to six characters at once, but you give them something to do that and a player get hold of it, it becomes a headache.

So glad they spilt the two up.
For folks who want that level of simulation, 3E is a much better choice, as it was the last time WotC tried the idea that all characters in a game world use the same rule system.
 

Magister Ludorum

Adventurer
Agree. As a DM, I hate that spell lists are removed from spellcasters. Hate it with a passion. It hugely dumbs down their tactical options and makes them way less interesting to run and challenging to fight. The worst offender of this new breed of stat block is the new version of Vecna, who is now barely a wizard and more a teleporting stabby guy.

This is simplification gone too far, for me.
Quoted because this says what I've been thinking.

I can no longer use any NPC stats in any books. Since D&D doesn't provide NPC write ups that are useful to me and I have to rebuild all the NPCs to give them character classes anyway, I've mostly stopped GMing D&D. I've been running Fantasy HERO instead.

My kids and I are working on a D20 Fantasy game combining our favorite parts of each edition. We'll have more time over the summer.

We want fewer hit points, more lethality and less gonzo character class abilities. But we don't want to use an earlier rule set without updating it to include the best of later editions.

A lack of PC/NPC transparency makes the game less fun for me as a player. And as a GM I feel that it reduces NPCs to a gamist bag of too many hit points and monster abilities.

YMMV but that's how most of my gaming group feels. If an NPC uses a magical ability, they want to be able to learn the spell, and if an NPC martial does something cool, they want to be able to learn how to do it.
 

Magister Ludorum

Adventurer
For folks who want that level of simulation, 3E is a much better choice, as it was the last time WotC tried the idea that all characters in a game world use the same rule system.
We ran 3e for years, but we disliked open ended ac and attack bonuses, and that's the version that inflated hit points to unreasonable levels. Also nit-picky fears that did little other than plug slots in a feat chain.
 

Nah that was a nightmare as a GM, loads of points stuff you were meant to do to follow character rules, and most of it would never actually come up in play. As it meant any ability you gave to a NPC you also had to allow players to get somehow, which causes all sorts of problems. You big bad needs to be able to fight four to six characters at once, but you give them something to do that and a player get hold of it, it becomes a headache.

So glad they spilt the two up.

I completely agree. I see a lot of posts here that bemoan the loss of all the extra stuff, but there are a lot of people who are glad the complexity is gone and we now have foes that are simple to run and don't bog down combat.
 

mamba

Legend
It's cause they're using the enforced "monster caster" stat blocks WotC recently pushed on everyone instead of the original "caster level and spell slot" one that's WAY more DM friendly.
If by ‘DM friendly’ you mean ‘requires more work and offers more potential to screw up for newer DMs’, then I’d agree

Realistically, pick the 5 spells you want the monster to have for thematic reasons and do not worry about spell slots at all, done.
The new block is closer to that than the old one
 
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TwoSix

Dirty, realism-hating munchkin powergamer
Agree. As a DM, I hate that spell lists are removed from spellcasters. Hate it with a passion. It hugely dumbs down their tactical options and makes them way less interesting to run and challenging to fight. The worst offender of this new breed of stat block is the new version of Vecna, who is now barely a wizard and more a teleporting stabby guy.

This is simplification gone too far, for me.
He’s Vecna. Whatever plot level magic or special ritual I need him to have, he’ll have. That’s not something I need spelled out in a stat block.
 

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