D&D (2024) How Will They Fix Warlock Spellcasting Issues?

[Mirrorrorrim]

It would work.

But I find it a bit too mechanical, and not narratively satisfying. What's the in character explanation of why you can't do it 3 times?

I also suggested this (as a person who doesn't like short rest pact magic).

Here are bullet points for one way it could work for me:

1. You get 2 DAILY pact spell slots that are cast at a higher level (just like 2014). You do have to prepare your pact spells from the entire Warlock list (including your Patron list at level 3) at the end of your long rest, but this makes you flexible from day to day, and not stuck in a certain build. In this variation, slots don't scale, rather what changes is how often and quickly you get to recharge those slots, tied to the Pact Boon ability below.
2. At first level, alongside your Pact Boon, you get a new Pact Communion Ritual with a 1 minute casting time. It allows you to utilize your Pact Boon object (blade, tome, familiar) as a focus to commune with forces beyond, letting you request an influx of power that recharges your Pact Magic slots. You can use this ritual more often, the greater your personal power (PBx/day, or twice per day to start). Additionally, whenever you use this Pact Communion to get spell slots, you can swap your prepared spells from any on the Warlock list, adding much needed flexibility.
3. This Pact Communion Ritual is the seed of something that will grow, and may be eventually more important by recharging other abilities, or communicating with a Patron in the future.
4. Starting at 3rd level, your Pact Communion ritual lets you connect with a Patron as part of you choosing your subclass. You need to be the best operative for that Patron as possible, so you can now select spells granted by your Patron subclass.
5. Each Patron may give you a special boon when you use the Communion ritual. Maybe Fiend gives you Dark One's Blessing effect without killing someone? Archfey gives you a modified Fey Presence that is not broken if used 2 to 6 times per day? Celestial lets you heal a certain amount 2-6 times per day? That kind of stuff.

This creates a new narrative-based recharge mechanic that while is limited in a single encounter, lets you prepare (and re-spec) for almost every encounter.

Levels 1-4 lets you cast up to 6 enhanced Pact Magic spell slots throughout the day; swappable 3x/day (counting your starting slots at the beginning of the day)
Levels 5-8 is 8 slots a day; swappable 4x/day
LEvels 9-12 is 10 slots a day; swappable 5x/day
Levels 13-16 is 12 slots a day; swappable 6x/day
Levels 17-20 is 14 slots a day; swappable 7x/day

This lets the higher level warlock Warlock cast up to 14 slots at 5th level of power throughout the day, but only 2 per encounter. I think this, plus eldritch blast reliability, plus 2-3 extra invocations for the class, and Mystic Arcanum dailies, allows for a great deal of flexibility, while not making them too powerful of a nova with each encounter.

 

[CleverNickName]

Oh. Infinite high level spell slots! I'd go earth genie pact and get wall of stone. Then I'd build a castle a day. I'd wall off any enemy like they had a cask of Amontillado. Wall of stone at will would be amazing.

And as the DM, I'd allow it. Over and over again, until you're bored with it.
"Here's another ogre for you. Have fun! What's that? You'd like another one? Sure, here ya go. You good now, or...?"

I imagine it would get dull pretty quick, and then we could move on.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

This needs to be the case in any version of the short rest.
I.E. if short rest is an action limited times per day, then wizard can get arcane recovery every time.

Why?

And then we can get rid of insane mechanics of "when you roll initiative".

What is “insane” about something that is only combat relevant recharging per combat encounter? That’s literally all that is.

What exactly is that?

It’s a thing you can do every combat encounter.

We having a bag of rats again?
Or attempting to slap a party member for 1 damage?

STR 8 wizard trying to slap a fighter with Heavy armor mastery?
Roll initiative. Get recharge. Profit.

None of this follows from having encounter rechargeabilities. This is trivially easy to avoid, and the DM decides when initiative is rolled anyway.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I also suggested this (as a person who doesn't like short rest pact magic).

Here are bullet points for one way it could work for me:

1. You get 2 DAILY pact spell slots that are cast at a higher level (just like 2014). You do have to prepare your pact spells from the entire Warlock list (including your Patron list at level 3) at the end of your long rest, but this makes you flexible from day to day, and not stuck in a certain build. In this variation, slots don't scale, rather what changes is how often and quickly you get to recharge those slots, tied to the Pact Boon ability below.
2. At first level, alongside your Pact Boon, you get a new Pact Communion Ritual with a 1 minute casting time. It allows you to utilize your Pact Boon object (blade, tome, familiar) as a focus to commune with forces beyond, letting you request an influx of power that recharges your Pact Magic slots. You can use this ritual more often, the greater your personal power (PBx/day, or twice per day to start). Additionally, whenever you use this Pact Communion to get spell slots, you can swap your prepared spells from any on the Warlock list, adding much needed flexibility.
3. This Pact Communion Ritual is the seed of something that will grow, and may be eventually more important by recharging other abilities, or communicating with a Patron in the future.
4. Starting at 3rd level, your Pact Communion ritual lets you connect with a Patron as part of you choosing your subclass. You need to be the best operative for that Patron as possible, so you can now select spells granted by your Patron subclass.
5. Each Patron may give you a special boon when you use the Communion ritual. Maybe Fiend gives you Dark One's Blessing effect without killing someone? Archfey gives you a modified Fey Presence that is not broken if used 2 to 6 times per day? Celestial lets you heal a certain amount 2-6 times per day? That kind of stuff.

This creates a new narrative-based recharge mechanic that while is limited in a single encounter, lets you prepare (and re-spec) for almost every encounter.

Levels 1-4 lets you cast up to 6 enhanced Pact Magic spell slots throughout the day; swappable 3x/day (counting your starting slots at the beginning of the day)
Levels 5-8 is 8 slots a day; swappable 4x/day
LEvels 9-12 is 10 slots a day; swappable 5x/day
Levels 13-16 is 12 slots a day; swappable 6x/day
Levels 17-20 is 14 slots a day; swappable 7x/day

This lets the higher level warlock Warlock cast up to 14 slots at 5th level of power throughout the day, but only 2 per encounter. I think this, plus eldritch blast reliability, plus 2-3 extra invocations for the class, and Mystic Arcanum dailies, allows for a great deal of flexibility, while not making them too powerful of a nova with each encounter.

This locks in exactly one relationship with the patron, and so is a very hard no.

It’s vastly simpler to just let them regain spell slots as a short ritual (not described as communion with your patron ffs) that can be done during a short rest, 2 per long rest. Done.

Extra invocations and whatever else is gravy.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I could fill the entire forum with multiclassing problems in 5E. It breaks so many parts of the game, it's no wonder that they made it an "optional" rule.

There is no part of the game broken by multiclassing. Some builds can be awkward as certain levels, and some DMs lose it at the false perception of OP MC builds, but nothing actually breaks.

 

[CleverNickName]

This is actually not bad.

The warlock spell is usually a buff or spoiler, not really the 'always must use' of full casters because your Invocations and EB should be doing the heavy lifting.

Oh. Infinite high level spell slots! I'd go earth genie pact and get wall of stone. Then I'd build a castle a day. I'd wall off any enemy like they had a cask of Amontillado. Wall of stone at will would be amazing.

After giving this some considerable thought (hat tip to my ADHD, for helping me hyperfocus), I've found a problem:

Counterspell.

I can already hear my players: "As a reaction, I counterspell....I use my action to recover my spell slot...as a reaction I counterspell...I use my reaction to recover my spell slot...as a reaction I counterspell...I use my action to recov--"

There are other spells that can be cast as bonus actions or reactions, which the player could then reset immediately afterward as an action (Misty Step, Hellish Rebuke, Hex, etc.) And all of them would be problematic to some degree. But I think that Counterspell is probably the worst among them. Nonstop counterspell is so much worse than casting Wall of Stone on every odd-numbered turn of initiative.

 

[Vaalingrade]

Recharge action is once per encounter, triggered by initiative roll or every ten minutes.

 

[mellored]

Oh. Infinite high level spell slots! I'd go earth genie pact and get wall of stone. Then I'd build a castle a day. I'd wall off any enemy like they had a cask of Amontillado. Wall of stone at will would be amazing.

Wall of stone is not a warlock spell (and they will ge their own spell list back).

After giving this some considerable thought (hat tip to my ADHD, for helping me hyperfocus), I've found a problem:

Counterspell.

Would that be terrible?
I mean, 3 classes already get silence. And your spending your entire turn on it.

Also, you can make counterspell a "once per long rest" invocation.

There are other spells that can be cast as bonus actions or reactions, which the player could then reset immediately afterward as an action (Misty Step, Hellish Rebuke, Hex, etc.) And all of them would be problematic to some degree.

At-will action to teleport 30' is not much more powerful from a disengage.

Hellish Rebuke as an action isn't breaking anything.

Hex as an action doesn't do anything by itself.

The more I think about it. The more I like it. It lets the warlocks be the at-will caster. Thet never run out of spells.

 

[mellored]

armor of agythis would also need to be moved to an invocation.

At-will THP would be a bit much, even if it cost 2 actions.

 

[tetrasodium]

My bet is you are the GM, you fix it.. design better encounters use a doom clock wandering monsters etc on this