D&D 5E Is "Mystic" a bad class name?

Here is the relevant passage (AD&D DMG, p 40):

"
When spell energy is released, it usually flows to the Prime Material from the Positive or Negative Material Plane. . . .

"

Magic absolutely had a source in AD&D!

Great quote!

Essentially, for Gygax in 1e, the ‘weave’ for magic spells is the Positive Energy Plane itself.

However.

This explanation is a single sentence. Gygax avoids baking in flavor into rules everywhere.

Moreover, while the ‘source’ for a spell seems to mostly be the Positive Energy Plane, and occasionally the Negative Energy Plane for certain spells, Gygax describes minimalistically that is only ‘usually’ these two planes, thus leaving the door open for any other plane as the ‘source’ of the spell, or any other kind of source besides planes.

Most importantly, the setting whose cosmology is (in this sentence) the source of the spell, is in the Dungeon Masters Guide. Not the Players Handbook. It is up to the DM to decide if this is the setting that the adventurers will be using for the spell.

Gygax makes a point to let the DM decide what the setting explanations will be.

Even in the Players Handbook, the cosmology that maps out the ‘Positive Energy Plane’ is in an appendix, is optional, is in the same section that psionics is in.

Gygax made everything optional - especially the setting.

Gygax wants players to choose whatever setting makes most sense in their own stories that they themselves create.
 

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Mysticism free of any religious concerns seems a rather modern invention to me.
(1) That seems true of magic in general, but religion-less magic has been a premise of D&D since day 1.

(2) Some posters are calling for psionics to have a sci-fi (= modern, presumably) flavour - this seems consistent with that.
 

As far as I can recall (and correct me if I'm wrong) there hasn't been that level of detail since.
I don't know what was in the 2nd ed core books. I don't remember anything like what I quoted in 3E. And I don't know about 3.5/PF. So no correction in respect of any of those!

In 4e the PHB had this (p 54):

Drawing on magical energy that permeates the cosmos, the arcane power source can be used for a wide variety of effects, from fireballs to flight to invisibility. Warlocks and wizards, for example, use arcane magic. Each class is the representative of a different tradition of arcane study, and other traditions exist. . . .

Divine magic comes from the gods. The gods grant power to their devotees, which clerics and paladins, for example, access through prayers and litanies.​

This is not as detailed as Gygax's DMG description. To me, it also gives rise to the usual confusion over why, exactly, a warlock counts as arcane. The use of "traditions" for arcane magic is also a bit weird, because a sorcerer doesn't really strike me as an exponent of a tradition.

With divine magic, there is also the following found on pp 61-62 (clerics) and p 92 (paladins):

As a cleric, your deity does not directly grant you powers. Instead, your ordination or investiture as a cleric grants you the ability to wield divine powers. Clerics are usually formally ordained by existing clerics who perform a special ritual to do so, but on rare occasions a deity moves to directly ordain a worthy worshiper without any sort of priestly hierarchy involved. What you do with your powers once you are ordained is up to you, although if you flagrantly and openly defy your deity’s tenets, you quickly earn the enmity of the faithful.

Paladins are not granted their powers directly by their deity, but instead through various rites performed when they first become paladins. Most of these rites involve days of prayer, vigils, tests and trials, and ritual purification followed by a knighting ceremony, but each faith has its own methods. This ceremony of investiture gives a paladin the ability to wield divine powers. Once initiated, the paladin is a paladin forevermore. How justly, honorably, or compassionately the paladin wields those powers from that day forward is up to him, and paladins who stray too far from the tenets of their faith are punished by other members of the faithful.​

This seems to contradict divine magic "coming from the gods", and also makes it even less clear how warlocks are different! It's actually closer to 5e, insofar as ordination/investiture seems just to be an alternative pathway to gaining control over "the Weave".

Gygax makes a point to let the DM decide what the setting explanations will be.

<snip>

Gygax made everything optional - especially the setting.

Gygax wants players to choose whatever setting makes most sense in their own stories that they themselves create.
Is 5e wildly different in this respect?
 

Yeah, a core jester class does sound a little crazy. I'd love to read through all his notes to see everything that didn't make it into the books.

If you think that's crazy, by the time Gygax mentioned the possibility there were already TWO jester classes published in Dragon Magazine by other authors.

I had - well, have - a player who once ran a PC with one of those Jester classes for a few sessions. A gnome if I recall correctly.

It was... ...an experience. :heh:
 

(1) That seems true of magic in general, but religion-less magic has been a premise of D&D since day 1.

(2) Some posters are calling for psionics to have a sci-fi (= modern, presumably) flavour - this seems consistent with that.

The problem is that to me, "Mystic" has too many religious connotations to be a good fit with a non-divine class.

I have no objection to having a class name for the Psi-using class that doesn't have feel too "modern", and I was thinking over the question of what's a good name for a "Mystic" which is free of religious overtones and I had a revelation.

How about Meditator?

It seems a good fit. A person who practices mental exercises to improve themselves and/or expand their abilities. It's an English word that can be used for the practitioners of many mystic techniques (just look at this search result for "Meditator" on Wikipedia), some of which claim to give the expert superhuman abilities. Plus the word doesn't have any "religious feel" to it.
 

As always, AD&D 2e took the "we don't know, figure it out" approach...

2e Player's Handbook said:
Although some characters can use spells, the workings of magic are dimly understood at best. There are many theories about where the power comes from. The most commonly accepted idea is that the mysterious combination of words, gestures, and materials that make up a spell somehow taps an extradimensional source of energy that in turn causes the desired effect. Somehow the components of the spells--those words, gestures and materials--route this energy to a specific and desired result. Fortunately, how this happens is not very important to the majority of wizards. It is enough to know that "when you do this, that happens."

More relevant however, is the write up on psionic power from the Complete Psionics Handbook

Complete Psionics said:
Living Psionics

Psionics - the harnessing and shaping of personal, internal energies - is a unique experience. Much like Zen, its essence cannot be described; it must be felt. At the heart of psionics is a tautology: only understanding brings understanding. Still, for the curious, what follows is an attempt to describe the psionic experience.

The first thing a psionicist learns is how to recognize internal energy. Everyone is filled with it, but most people are completely unaware of it. It suffuses our being 24 hours a day, building up during times of rest and draining away during times of exertion or stress. The psionicist learns to turn his awareness inward and search for this energy. Gradually, he gathers it together, drawing it toward some spot. The notion of drawing is key, because this energy cannot be pushed or forced; it must be enticed to accumulate. An experienced psionicist can gather his energies continuously and unconsciously. For a beginner, however, this is the first and most important breakthrough.

Once an amount of energy has been gathered, the psionicist can begin shaping it. The closest description for this bundle of energy is a "warm spot" at the gathering point. Initially, warm spots are easiest to form at the front of the brain. As the budding psionicist practices, he learns to move it around. Eventually, he can gather energy anywhere: his head, his hand, his shoulder, his back. The precise location is important when using some powers, but not all. The energy is not shaped in the normal sense of that word. Instead, primed may be a better label. The psionicist visualizes the effect he wants. The stronger the visualization, the more likely it is to succeed. When the gathering reaches its peak, the energy is usually realized in a single, explosive release.

Many psionicists describe this release as an instantaneous increase in the apparent temperature of the warm spot, accompanied by a "beat" sensation - as if the warm spot had fired spikes of energy in a radial pattern through the psionicist's body. This sensation is strongest when the psionicist is directing energy outward in an aggressive fashion - when moving an object, for example. If the power being used is directional, the spikes are strongest in that direction, and very minor in others. If power's effects continue for more than a few moments, the beat also continues, but at much lower intensity.

Contact, a common and vital power, has another physical manifestation. Rather than a warm spot, subjects describe the sensation of contact as a "thick spot" or a "heavy spot" somewhere in the mind. They usually have trouble locating it precisely (front, back, left, right), but feel nonetheless that it is a definite place. Forcible contact (as in telepathic combat) is similar, but much more extreme. Each tangent arrives "like a gallstone in the mind" according to Bezelar Mujarif, a prominent psionicist now residing in Calimshan. When contact finally comes, he adds, it feels "like a tiger has unsheathed its claws in your head."

Clairvoyant powers tend to operate one of two ways. Either the power simply layers over the psionicist's normal senses (clairaudience, clairvoyance) or brings information in snatches and bursts of insight (object reading, precognition).

Nonpsionicists often imagine that a telepath can "eavesdrop" on their thoughts. That's not quite true. If a psionicist uses telepathy, the target's thoughts do not flood into his mind, masquerading as his own thoughts, or interfering with them. Instead, the thoughts come forth as simple knowledge. The psionicist knows what the target is thinking, as if someone had told him hours before and he just now remembered.
 

The problem is that to me, "Mystic" has too many religious connotations to be a good fit with a non-divine class.

I have no objection to having a class name for the Psi-using class that doesn't have feel too "modern", and I was thinking over the question of what's a good name for a "Mystic" which is free of religious overtones and I had a revelation.

How about Meditator?

It seems a good fit. A person who practices mental exercises to improve themselves and/or expand their abilities. It's an English word that can be used for the practitioners of many mystic techniques (just look at this search result for "Meditator" on Wikipedia), some of which claim to give the expert superhuman abilities. Plus the word doesn't have any "religious feel" to it.

Really? I honestly don't associate mystics with religion particularly. Philosophies, maybe, but, not really religion in the "There's a god somewhere" sense. Much more contemplative - what is the sound of one hand clapping sort of thing.

But I gotta say, I don7t like Meditator, and I can see the instant, ahem, shall we say ribald humour that such a name would engender around my table.
 


And, to me, a psychic is just someone who reads palms and tries to talk to your dead grandmother. Psychics don't levitate and they certainly don't have anything remotely offensive in nature. A psychic is Jennifer Love-Hewitt talking to dead ghosts. At least, that's what I associate with psychic. A mystic, on the other hand, is mysterious, so, we don't really know what they're capable of.

And, I'm curious. For those that are really bothered by the idea of psionics being tied to the Far Realms, why don't you have similar issues with all magic being tied to the Weave? Isn't that just as intrusive? Maybe I've just missed it, but, for the past year of 5e, all magic, whether arcane or divine, comes from The Weave. That's a huge change from previous D&D lore where clerical spells were granted by gods. Why aren't clerics just another wizard?

I wouldn't have been against the Warhammer 40,000 term, Psyker. Obviously copyrighted, but I may use it in my own games. There are a few excellent terms for those with psionic power out there.

I use the term mystic enough in a campaign to refer to hedgemage types to use it also for psionic PCs.
 

Really? I honestly don't associate mystics with religion particularly. Philosophies, maybe, but, not really religion in the "There's a god somewhere" sense. Much more contemplative - what is the sound of one hand clapping sort of thing.

Yes, well that's the whole problem isn't it.

These words have very different associations to people depending upon their individual experiences, and this whole thread's been spent arguing over them.

To me, a Mystic could be one of many things, but it makes me think of either (a) an initiate of a Mystery cult (the original meaning), (b) an occultist (who in D&D terms would probably just be an expert with some obscure Knowledge skills, but would likely be a ritual spellcaster of some kind if their powers were literally true), or (c) a shyster or stage performer who get money by claiming to possess "secrets of the Oriental swamis" and the like.

When I think of someone with psionic abilities, terms like "Psychic" come to mind, not "Mystic".
 

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