D&D (2024) Two Weapon Fighting and Nick article

[MonsterEnvy]

Could be nice on a Ranger that already got Hunter’s Mark up.

 

[DarkCrisis]

Can you just not use weapon mastery stuff? Legit question

 

[mellored]

Can you just not use weapon mastery stuff? Legit question

Bard, cleric, druid, monk, sorcerer, warlock, or warlock do not get it.

And most masteries say "you can". So you don't need to Push or Slow if you don't want to.

Only Sap and Vex say "creature has" or "you have", respectively.

Or I guess you can take mastery in weapons you are not carrying. Wield a Greatsword and have mastery in hand and heavy crossbows for instance. That would do nothing.

 

[tglassy]

Can you just not use weapon mastery stuff? Legit question

Not sure what you're asking. If you don't want to add extra affects, you don't have to.

In the case we're talking about, it has to do with the Light Property. The Light Property allows you to make an off hand attack as a bonus action if you are wielding two Light weapons. So, a lvl 5 Fighter would have two attacks as part of his Attack action, and one attack as a bonus action with the off hand. Just like 2014 DND.

If you have the weapon Mastery over a weapon that grants Nick, then the Nick Weapon Mastery allows you to make the bonus action attack granted by the Light Property and makes it a part of the Attack Action. So that same Fighter, if he were using a scimitar and had Mastery over it, would make three attacks as part of his Attack Action, and still have a bonus action to use on something else.

And that's where the Dual Wielding Feat comes in. It allows a SEPERATE Bonus Action attack, distinct from the one granted by the Light Property. So if you have mastery over Scimitar's, and are wielding two weapons, That same Fighter can then make 3 attacks as part of their action and another one with their bonus action.

Most classes don't get Masteries, however. Just predominantly martial ones, unless they take a Feat.

 

[Thommy H-H]

Can you just not use weapon mastery stuff? Legit question

It seems a simple enough module to ignore. Nothing else really hinges on it afaict. Monsters don't use them either (perhaps the MM will present it as an option for named NPCs or something) so it certainly won't break the game. I don't think any of the effects are powerful enough to significantly unbalance anything either - the potential exploit discussed in this thread amounts to maybe getting an extra attack, but requires burning at least one feat to pull off - so by the same token, not using them shouldn't be a massive hit to any PC's power level. I expect they'll get a lot of play at lower levels when parties are smacking goblins around and the effects are quite pronounced, but I'm not sure they'll survive to mid- and high-tier games, when there's enough to keep track of already and a dragon's not going to be meaningfully inconvenienced by something so minor anyway.

And yeah, they're all phrased as requiring the wielder to decide to use them. They could just not.

 

[Kobold Stew]

The new rules for weapon swapping appear to handwave drawing and stowing, letting you do both as part of an attack.

Are you sure this is what it says? Has this been confirmed? I am surprised that it removes any drawing/stowing restrictions.

It all seems complex but reasonable otherwise.

 

[Thommy H-H]

Are you sure this is what it says? Has this been confirmed? I am surprised that it removes any drawing/stowing restrictions.

No, it doesn't. See my later post. I was basing it on what the article in the OP claimed, but that was incorrect. The actual rules are much the same as 2014.

 

[tglassy]

It seems a simple enough module to ignore. Nothing else really hinges on it afaict. Monsters don't use them either (perhaps the MM will present it as an option for named NPCs or something) so it certainly won't break the game. I don't think any of the effects are powerful enough to significantly unbalance anything either - the potential exploit discussed in this thread amounts to maybe getting an extra attack, but requires burning at least one feat to pull off - so by the same token, not using them shouldn't be a massive hit to any PC's power level. I expect they'll get a lot of play at lower levels when parties are smacking goblins around and the effects are quite pronounced, but I'm not sure they'll survive to mid- and high-tier games, when there's enough to keep track of already and a dragon's not going to be meaningfully inconvenienced by something so minor anyway.

And yeah, they're all phrased as requiring the wielder to decide to use them. They could just not.

I disagree. Vehimently. I play tested the new Fighter with Masteries last fall, and no one else in the group used them. I was, consistently, overshadowing the other players in damage and survivability.

Being able to knock down anyone you hit, every time you hit, or granting yourself basically near permanent advantage, or imposing disadvantage more consistently than Vicious Mockery, or, and this was a big one, dealing damage even if you miss...all those nearly changed the game. So much so that eventually the DM made me go back to using the old version, and we were lvl 8 at the time. Which, despite its low number is pretty high for most campaigns.

They don't scale, so they become LESS effective as you get higher level, but they're still always useful. Rogues can grant themselves near unlimited advantage, Fighters can do reliable damaqe hit or miss, etc.

 

[Thommy H-H]

I disagree. Vehimently. I play tested the new Fighter with Masteries last fall, and no one else in the group used them.

Well, there's your problem. If every (non full caster) class gets a bump in power and versatility, but only one of the party uses those options, that character's going to seem overpowered.

When I say it's easy to remove the module, I mean that a DM can opt to not use the rules in the game without it wrecking this version of D&D. I wouldn't necessarily advocate that players within the same group pick and choose whether to use the mastery properties or not, at least if being the same power level is a concern for them.

 

[tglassy]

Well, there's your problem. If every (non full caster) class gets a bump in power and versatility, but only one of the party uses those options, that character's going to seem overpowered.

When I say it's easy to remove the module, I mean that a DM can opt to not use the rules in the game without it wrecking this version of D&D. I wouldn't necessarily advocate that players within the same group pick and choose whether to use the mastery properties or not, at least if being the same power level is a concern for them.

But that's not what you said. What you said was it's not that powerful, PC's will forget about them by mid to high levels, and not having them shouldn't make much of a difference. Which Is what I disagree with. It is an extremely significant upgrade.

Also no. one else played a class that would have gotten masteries anyway.