D&D 5E UA 8 Bastions and Cantrips playtest survey is now live. Update now closed.

Leatherhead

Possibly a Idiot.
The thing I think most people forget is that not a single person at WotC cares about (general) YOUR opinion.

That's not the real issue here.

WotC simply does not have the time to waste on revising anything more complex than a simple tweak here and there. These playtests have effectively two results you can vote on : Throw it away (and keep the 2014 rules), or Use these new rules (basically) as-is.

"The presented system is flawed, but the idea is good, try a different approach" is simply not an option for feedback.
 

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That's not the real issue here.

WotC simply does not have the time to waste on revising anything more complex than a simple tweak here and there. These playtests have effectively two results you can vote on : Throw it away (and keep the 2014 rules), or Use these new rules (basically) as-is.

"The presented system is flawed, but the idea is good, try a different approach" is simply not an option for feedback.
Something has to go into the books. So I am not entirely sure of that.
 

Stormonu

Legend
Why? We need 65%... Do you think there are more people besides us on ENworld that fill out those surveys?
Yes, I do. Or at the very least I would hope that more than 20 people fill out their surveys. You want as many eyes as you can get on this. Not 20 out of a few million people who might end up using it.
 

DEFCON 1

Legend
Supporter
That's not the real issue here.

WotC simply does not have the time to waste on revising anything more complex than a simple tweak here and there. These playtests have effectively two results you can vote on : Throw it away (and keep the 2014 rules), or Use these new rules (basically) as-is.

"The presented system is flawed, but the idea is good, try a different approach" is simply not an option for feedback.
We have no idea how much time they need to revise anything. So while you may think anything in these playtests are now all-or-nothing... I do not agree with that assessment. I have seen nothing to suggest they are unable to revise anything they receive responses on because they are "out of time".
 


TwoSix

Dirty, realism-hating munchkin powergamer
I lambasted the implementation and not the concept and included specific advice in each text field on how to make a system that would work for me. Of course, if they just look at all the "Highly Unsatisfied" ratings I and others gave and then conclude "Well, that didn't spark joy. Bin it!" that is really on them and their survey methodology than on the players who took the time to read, playtest and grok 23 pages of fairly dense game rules and fill out a survey on it.
I mean, if a lot of the feedback is “I love the bastion system but hate pretty much every part of how you actually did it”, they might simply decide the juice isn’t worth the extra squeeze.
 



Iosue

Legend
I like DEFCON 1’s approach, but the fact of the matter is, at the numbers WotC is dealing with, you can fill out the survey however the heck you want, and it won’t be more than a ripple in a river. Unless you organize some kind of mass action.

70% is the threshold for further iteration, 80% and above is accepted, pending tweaks based on internal playtesting and/or survey comments. It is rare and difficult to clear 80% on the first try. I think only Advantage/Disadvantage, Proficiency Bonus, and now Cunning Strike have achieved that. Everything else has been iterated on.

At 69% or lower, necessary elements get redesigned and peripheral elements get canned. Bastions is the kind of thing to get canned. The thing is, if it gets on 69% approval, it means most people just went, “Meh.” Whether you gave it 5 stars, 3 stars, or 1 star, the problem is that most people just said, “Eh.” One response, no matter how eloquently commented, nor how poorly rated in bad faith, is not going to change that. Not even a hundred such responses would move the needle. Rest assured that if you hate some feature, it will be removed if thousands of other people hate it, too. Same with a feature you like. Just be prepared that you may find yourself in the minority. If you think Bastions needs another pass, or even heavy revision, but 80% are satisfied, and it goes in relatively unchanged, well, that’s the system working as intended.

So rate things however you want. But if you really want to engage with the survey, leave constructive comments. We know they read those, and as this Treantmonk video shows, such comments can actually inspire action.
 


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