Heroes Season [Volume] 2 (#34)---12/03/07-'POWERLESS' Mid-Season Finale (or the End)

[Dire Bare]

Just because people don't act like a Special Forces operative and choose the most optimal solution within microseconds when they are confronted with a problem doesn't make them stupid. It's like listening to D&D players dissect a book and call all the character idiots because they react as people would instead of machines; it's armchair quarterbacking at it's worst. They call writers stupid or lazy when it's really their own blindness as to how drama and tension are built and maintained, and how characters or plot are developed. This is why most D&D players that try to write turn out to be terrible at it. In fact they're worse than terrible at it.

Tumbling the locks? Having TK doesn't magically grant him the knowledge of the combination. Nor does it give him X-ray vision to see how the thing is constructed.

Radiation? Enough radiation to go through a bank vault door would also kill everyone around him, if he's even good enough to generate that much radiation without blowing up again. I'm surprised he had the guts to turn on that power again.

I'm not even sure that Peter knows he can teleport, yet. I don't think he's ever done it; he's never stumbled onto the 'space' part of Hiro's Space/Time Control power. Remember that just because he has a power doesn't mean he knows how it works. He still has at least, what, five or six powers he doesn't even know he has.

Yes, he could phase through but (1) it isn't as cool and (2) he doesn't know what the virus looks like or where it is. I'm not sure he was calm enough to do both himself and Adam anyway but that gets beside the point: appropriate drama and tension almost require that the door be open. So we can have the confrontation that occurs. Remember: characters without the appropriate training, preperation and attitude always doing the correct, perfect thing like they were looking at things in the third person and were removed from time contraints is bad writing.

Peter's come a long way in learning how to use his various powers, but remember that he has a harder road than anyone else does. Sylar's power by it's very nature seems to give him control very, very quickly. Peter has to learn like everyone else has, but he has a lot more to absorb. Also, rememeber that almost everyone's power is governed by their emotional state and Peter seems way more high-strung than most of the others. He's very reactive instead of proactive, and operates on an emotional level rather than an intellectual level most of the time: that's a prime facet of his character and also what keeps him from being an overbalanced ubermensch. That emotional swing lets him use his powers in an instinctual way but half the time when he tries to use them, he fails because he's thinking about it too much. He only really cuts loose when he's scared or when he's pissed off. We saw the same thing with Hiro in Season One but Hiro has grown up more than Peter has. In many ways Peter is still the kid he was in Season One. He's gotten better at that, too, but people don't change overnight and the writer's seem to get that.

You've summed up my thoughts perfectly. Thanks!

 

[Felon]

Just because people don't act like a Special Forces operative and choose the most optimal solution within microseconds when they are confronted with a problem doesn't make them stupid.

No, but that extreme behavior is not how anyone's suggesting Peter should act, so you're without a point on that count. Failing to exercise reasonable degrees of intelligence is what makes one stupid.

You start off doing OK in your counter-arguement, but then you allow yourself an easy cop-out when you throw out "it isn't as cool" as a defense--unless, of course, you're suggesting that doing the coolest possible thing is a priority for Peter himself, not his writers.

Admittedly though, the handling of the vault isn't nearly as big of a non sequitor as the way the assassination played out.

You've summed up my thoughts perfectly. Thanks!

To reiterate from a couple of pages back:

There is a real double-standard that I see about Heroes in these threads. If the characters act stupidly or display bathos, somebody defends the show for portraying the characters as real people, not larger-than-life comic book characters.

Then when the show has its moments where something is handled in a ham-handed manner for dramatic purposes, somebody jumps forth to defend it as being very true to its comic-book inspirations.

And sometimes it's the same darn person.

 

[Grog]

Just because people don't act like a Special Forces operative and choose the most optimal solution within microseconds when they are confronted with a problem doesn't make them stupid.

No, doing stupid things makes them stupid. Peter not reading Adam's mind to find out the truth after he had multiple people tell him Adam was a bad guy was stupid. Alejandro confronting a confessed murderer alone in a secluded area without a weapon or a plan of any kind was stupid. Maya trusting Sylar over her own brother was stupid. Any number of things Mohinder did this season were stupid. And on and on.

Yes, he could phase through but (1) it isn't as cool and (2) he doesn't know what the virus looks like or where it is. I'm not sure he was calm enough to do both himself and Adam anyway but that gets beside the point: appropriate drama and tension almost require that the door be open. So we can have the confrontation that occurs.

Yes, that's it exactly. Peter had to be out in the hallway and not in the vault so that Nathan could reach him, talk to him, and convince him that Adam wanted to release the virus. Unfortunately, that's a concern that's completely external to the story. There was no reason within the context of the story for Peter not to just phase through the vault door. The only reason he didn't do it is because the writers needed him to be out in the hallway.

When you let concerns outside the story influence what happens in the story, that's bad writing, plain and simple.

Remember: characters without the appropriate training, preperation and attitude always doing the correct, perfect thing like they were looking at things in the third person and were removed from time contraints is bad writing.

I don't want the characters to always do "the correct, perfect thing." I want them to act like people with functioning brains. That didn't happen this season.

 

[Brown Jenkin]

The solution I came up with to Peter actually relates to Mohinder. Since Mohinder's sister was somehow powered and responsible for the Shanti virus then genetically Mohinder probably has a super power too, the question is just what is it. My answer is Super Stupidity. If people can have super iinteligence, then why not super stupidity. Mohinder has certainly displayed way more stupidity than a normal person. So since Peter absorbs other peoples powers (with some working automatically like the regeneration) he has absorbed Mohinder's Super Stupdity and can't turn it off.

 

[Darkwolf71]

He does; that's how he gets Adam and himself out of the Company prison. I think he does it at least one other time but I can't remember right off hand. He seems to have to work himself up to do it, though.

Hm, I forgot about the escape from the company. :\

 

[Psion]

I think what Hiro did makes him less a hero. He could have been merciful, and he wasn't. That's sad.

I think one of the main points/"signature moves" of Heroes is showing you most characters in both an unsympathetic and sympathetic light. In season 1, HRG was a big example of this. In season 2, I went from thinking of Veronica Mars Elle as a dispensable annoyance of a character to someone I am interested in seeing develop.

And I preferred Sylar the way he was in Volume 2. He was a far more interesting character. I am not looking forward to him in Volume 3, to be honest.

I'm not looking forward to it either. Sylar was interesting, but I, too, think he's "done" unless they come up with a fresh angle.

Interesting side note: Adams "death" is pretty similar to the death of another show the same actor played in (Alias) - immortal but trapped forever...

I noticed that...

I am still a bit disappointed that it's really supposed to be possible to kill Adam by blowing off his head. But we might never learn the truth about that.

Oh, you just know he's going to be back. I look forward to a scene where Hiro sticks him through the head with his sword.


On other topics...

I don't share the Niki hate, but was disappointed they didn't find anything interesting to do with her this season. I wonder if she's really done. I wonder if somehow she'll turn out to be the third Peter/Sylar type character (each personality a different power...) Niki is my wife's favorite character.

The Monica/Micah storyline has potential, hope they go somewhere good with it.

I wonder if over the course of the series, we see pivotal characters like Matt evolve into the next generation of Linderman/Ma Pitrelli types in the name of protecting those they care about.

Good lord I'm bored with the Claire storyline. It needs a fresh direction, too.

West needs to go.

 

[RangerWickett]

The solution I came up with to Peter actually relates to Mohinder. Since Mohinder's sister was somehow powered and responsible for the Shanti virus then genetically Mohinder probably has a super power too, the question is just what is it. My answer is Super Stupidity. If people can have super iinteligence, then why not super stupidity. Mohinder has certainly displayed way more stupidity than a normal person. So since Peter absorbs other peoples powers (with some working automatically like the regeneration) he has absorbed Mohinder's Super Stupdity and can't turn it off.

lol

 

[TheLe]

Yes, Heroes is very comic book. I guess you either like that or you don't.

Alot of comic books today are written much much smarter than Heroes. Shoot, there are children's daytime tv shows that are written smarter than Heroes.


~Le

 

[DonTadow]

No, doing stupid things makes them stupid. Peter not reading Adam's mind to find out the truth after he had multiple people tell him Adam was a bad guy was stupid. Alejandro confronting a confessed murderer alone in a secluded area without a weapon or a plan of any kind was stupid. Maya trusting Sylar over her own brother was stupid. Any number of things Mohinder did this season were stupid. And on and on.


Yes, that's it exactly. Peter had to be out in the hallway and not in the vault so that Nathan could reach him, talk to him, and convince him that Adam wanted to release the virus. Unfortunately, that's a concern that's completely external to the story. There was no reason within the context of the story for Peter not to just phase through the vault door. The only reason he didn't do it is because the writers needed him to be out in the hallway.

When you let concerns outside the story influence what happens in the story, that's bad writing, plain and simple.

I really would hate to have the last poster as a fan of anything i did. Heroes had some greatmoments this season, things that clearly overshadowed the quick pacing mohinder and sylar out ofthe sky moments.


I don't want the characters to always do "the correct, perfect thing." I want them to act like people with functioning brains. That didn't happen this season.

I've met people in real life who've been my frfiends for some time and take the actions of some new person their dating over my word. Guy or girl. So that wasn't so bad. Thought i'd have liked to have seen a scene, it was talked about earlier how the old heroes know howto block that power. That was demonstrated by two other heroes, which makes me believe that adam had it too, probably better. I've seen comic book villains who could resist a heroes powers.
Also know that adam was munipulating Parkman's dad, a stronger mind reader. That also lets me know that adam may have a strong resistance to the mind reading than others. Remember its only surface thoughts.
Blame the quick story arc for the messups not the usual work of the writers.

As for the phasing power, i'm betting there is a limit to how thick you can phase. I don't think peter or anyone else wants to test the limitations of that power.

I got to agree with the the person you're responding too (everthing but mohinder, he was an idiot this season whose motives consistently changed- but that was because they had not quite developed mohinder and molly's relationship deeply enough where we would believe he was that stupid)