How I'd fix Star Wars

UngainlyTitan

Legend
Supporter
Return of the Jedi is indeed an important film and capstone to the trilogy.

But honestly, after seeing it again after watching it in a row with A New Hope and The Empire Strikes Back... it is half a good film. Tantoine sequence? Excellent. Everything with Darth Vader, and then Luke, Darth Vader and the Emperor? Fantastic. The space battle? Pretty good, especially the realisation that it's a trap. A lot of individual character scenes? Great. And the ending shots are cool as heck.

... but jesus, I really do wish they had gone with Wookies (as hard as it would have been) over the Ewoks. It just doesn't suit the tone. And the battle on Endor is just a bit too messy and not clear cut to me; nor with the speedbike battle.

I don't know. I like cute and silly stuff being thrust into a serious environment, but I feel it fell flat here, and it bothers me now more than it did when I was a kid.

Just... imagining Chewie getting an emotional arc as he helps his people stand up to the Empire - watching a bunch of Wookies go toe-to-toe against the Empire... it'd be great stuff.
My issue with the Endor portion of the Battle of Endor is the primitive nature of the Ewoks and that the Imperial base is a bunker surrounded by trees. Not even a clear field of fire all around. The Empire has the resources to build a death star in orbit and could not level 100 sq. km. of forest to build a proper fort.
It makes the Empire Incompetent and trivialises them as a threat. But yeah! the reast of the movie is pretty good.
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Ryujin

Legend
My issue with the Endor portion of the Battle of Endor is the primitive nature of the Ewoks and that the Imperial base is a bunker surrounded by trees. Not even a clear field of fire all around. The Empire has the resources to build a death star in orbit and could not level 100 sq. km. of forest to build a proper fort.
It makes the Empire Incompetent and trivialises them as a threat. But yeah! the reast of the movie is pretty good.
That's the "back door", but I agree. Any reasonable military organization would have cleared everything for a couple of hundred metres around, unless they were actively trying to hide it. Which might have been the point.
 

UngainlyTitan

Legend
Supporter
That's the "back door", but I agree. Any reasonable military organization would have cleared everything for a couple of hundred metres around, unless they were actively trying to hide it. Which might have been the point.
It works on the first watch but does not bear examination. The whole defence of the base is incompetent. Lucas should have done what he did for the space dog fights and stolen the infiltration mission form the Guns of Navarone or something like that.
 



There is a lot of difference between supposed to look vulnerable and being actually vulnerable.
It wasn't remotely vulnerable, if you rule out the ewoks as a threat, as any sensible but genre-blind imperial would.

Which would have been a problem with using wookiees - they are quite obviously a potential threat.
 
Last edited:


billd91

Not your screen monkey (he/him)
Instead of understanding it's importance, he and RJ simply tried to erase it.

Instead of making a film that built on Return of the Jedi, and thus appeal to generations of fans while bringing in new fans....they tried to undo it instead and managed to DEEPLY divide the Star Wars audience.
In a word: No.
I don't think they misunderstood Return of the Jedi and tried to erase it. Rather, they picked up some of the strains out there in expanded universe stories - an imperial remnant that can resurge to cause problems. And they did so because any sequels, whether in the EU or in official movies, need some kind of conflict. The EU had imperial remnants, the Yuzhan Vong, and Leia and Han's kids - including one spiraling into the Dark Side - to generate most of that conflict. The sequel trilogy incorporated 2 of those 3.

People are free to disagree with how they generated conflict or portrayed the characters 30 years later. But there's no real basis to say they tried to erase RotJ.
 

GreyLord

Legend
In a word: No.
I don't think they misunderstood Return of the Jedi and tried to erase it. Rather, they picked up some of the strains out there in expanded universe stories - an imperial remnant that can resurge to cause problems. And they did so because any sequels, whether in the EU or in official movies, need some kind of conflict. The EU had imperial remnants, the Yuzhan Vong, and Leia and Han's kids - including one spiraling into the Dark Side - to generate most of that conflict. The sequel trilogy incorporated 2 of those 3.

People are free to disagree with how they generated conflict or portrayed the characters 30 years later. But there's no real basis to say they tried to erase RotJ.

If I recall, JJ Abrahms said he LOVED Star Wars. However, he also said he loved Empire Strikes back...BUT...did not like The Return of the Jedi. This is why I was prompted to respond how I did, because it was the sentiment of the post (no good Star Wars after 1980) that was reflected by JJ Abrahms.

Now, with the First movie, he REALLY loved it from what I understand. He didn't really care for Star Trek (which is irony as I think he probably got the job for Star Wars based on how well he resurrected or at least revived what others saw as a dying movie franchise at the time), but really loved Star Wars itself.

And I think he nailed the Star Wars FEEL because of that love of the first two films. However, the part they missed is that Star Wars is a fairy tale, and the Return of the Jedi is the end of that fairy tale. You don't continue a fairy tale by saying the Happily Ever after was a bust (Han and Leia separating, Luke giving up on the personal growth he already had through two movies, etc).

RJ is tougher to see. He absolutely LOVES film (at least from what I see). He GETS film. Thus, as Star Wars is a significant film, he loves it. He Loves Star Wars as a film, but he doesn't LOVE Star Wars from what I see. He is very good at what he does, but that doesn't mean he was the right fit for a film to follow what Abrahms did. Their styles conflict. I tend to like Abrahms style a LOT. I can see the strengths of RJ's style. But, it is blatantly obvious they were trying to erase the Return of the Jedi.

It was an attempt at a soft reboot. That is one way to have a reboot, erase what happened and reboot the entire thing again. It is a similar to what they did with James Bond...but I FEEL Broccoli did it better

PS: Now granted, I actually don't think JJ would have gone full on ball to erase the gains of the Return of the Jedi (his initial take on what to do when Luke appears is said to have been VASTLY different then what we saw, which was supposedly done because Johnson asked him to do it that way). You can also see he tries to change that vector in Rise of Skywalker...but the initial foundation of some of the items doing away with Return of the Jedi are there in a very strong fashion. This is the problem when you have different directors with very different styles and approaches take the reins in the same movie franchise sometimes. Their views clash, and in this case, became an unorganized mess. JJ DID love the first two Star Wars films and that actually shows. His style is a more fast paced and hectic action type. Johnson is more of a Hollywood guy. He isn't there to do a happy film, but to integrate the aspects of hollywood and callbacks to film in his creations. He loves the art of it. He went a way which was opened by The Force Awakens, but not necessarily the way Abrahms was intending. While the Force awakens set the foundation of it, the Last Jedi sealed the crushing of the Return of the Jedi. The Rise of Skywalker was just an attempt to salvage what was left, and that left a lot of people unhappy as it didn't really gel with the Last Jedi either. I love it because Abrahms still nails the Star Wars feel in my opinion, but many see it as a jumbled mess because it is not really true to the themes set in the Last Jedi. It makes the Sequel Trilogy a jumbled mess of sorts. The visions were not coherent throughout the Trilogy.
 
Last edited:

Ryujin

Legend
If I recall, JJ Abrahms said he LOVED Star Wars. However, he also said he loved Empire Strikes back...BUT...did not like The Return of the Jedi. This is why I was prompted to respond how I did, because it was the sentiment of the post (no good Star Wars after 1980) that was reflected by JJ Abrahms.

Now, with the First movie, he REALLY loved it from what I understand. He didn't really care for Star Trek (which is irony as I think he probably got the job for Star Wars based on how well he resurrected or at least revived what others saw as a dying movie franchise at the time), but really loved Star Wars itself.

And I think he nailed the Star Wars FEEL because of that love of the first two films. However, the part they missed is that Star Wars is a fairy tale, and the Return of the Jedi is the end of that fairy tale. You don't continue a fairy tale by saying the Happily Ever after was a bust (Han and Leia separating, Luke giving up on the personal growth he already had through two movies, etc).

RJ is tougher to see. He absolutely LOVES film (at least from what I see). He GETS film. Thus, as Star Wars is a significant film, he loves it. He Loves Star Wars as a film, but he doesn't LOVE Star Wars from what I see. He is very good at what he does, but that doesn't mean he was the right fit for a film to follow what Abrahms did. Their styles conflict. I tend to like Abrahms style a LOT. I can see the strengths of RJ's style. But, it is blatantly obvious they were trying to erase the Return of the Jedi.

It was an attempt at a soft reboot. That is one way to have a reboot, erase what happened and reboot the entire thing again. It is a similar to what they did with James Bond...but I FEEL Broccoli did it better
If you're doing a trilogy then you bring in the same team on all three, if at all possible. If you don't, you get the sort of creative fight that we got in the sequels.
 

Remove ads

AD6_gamerati_skyscraper

Remove ads

Upcoming Releases

Top