Heroes Season [Volume] 2 (#32)---11/19/07-'Cautionary Tales'

[Taelorn76]

Right. Nathan didn't know he had a kid until after the child was born. At birth, the Company switches out Nathan's real kid, flyboy, for Adam's kid, Clare, who the Company is trying to hide from Adam, lest Adam kill Clare as potentially able to withstand Adam who the Company has long since feared was too powerful. Meanwhile, the Company, who has a prior relationship with trailerpark mom when they took Elle off her hands and gave Elle to Bob, on which to experiment and turn into an assassin, sends Noah to take out trailerpark mom since she is unstable but Noah fakes a fire, pays off trailerpark mom to take a powder and passes flyboy on to some other foster parents, keeping tabs on him periodically. It's why, when Noah's family had to run, they could so easily move near flyboy, as Noah was keeping a second life going there as one of his "paper" Company business trips. A little later, trailerpark mom resurfaces again anyway and puts the squeeze on Nathan's family which was intercepted by Angela, then part of the Company, who pays off trailerpark mom yet again. In this scenario even trailerpark mom does not know that Clare is not her and Nathan's kid. Angela does and it is one of the very deep secrets she is deparately trying to keep so that Adam never finds out. Bob, perhaps now working for Adam, suspects but is not sure of Clare's actual heritage and it is the real reason he wants either Clare or some of her blood.

Firemommy knows she had a daughter not a son. And her daughter could not be Elle because there is a 6 year difference between the two.

 

[LightPhoenix]

By everything that happened in the show.

Ma Petrelli helps Claire because she is her daughter.
Nathan pays Firemommy to keep her mouth shut about her daughter.
Firemommy says Nathan is Claires daughter.

I think you meant granddaughter for Ma Petrelli.

Confirmed by who?

We have to assume the events in the show (and comic, if you consider it canon as well) are not lying to us. Otherwise, we can't assume anything, and Occam's Razor doesn't apply.

As an aside, it's why I hate Candice's power, and I hope Sylar doesn't get it. It's a vehicle for the show to lie to the viewer, and then all of us that like to speculate can't really do so because all events are automatically suspect.

 

[Steel_Wind]

I think Occam's Razor suggests very little, because we don't have enough data to make an informed assumption. The only confirmed instances of parents with powers who have children with powers are:

3) Mr. Walker -> Molly (note: Mrs. Walker did not have a power, else Sylar would have eaten her brains as well)

DO we know that Sylar didn't play with his fingers in her head? I had actually assumed that he had. How do we know he didn't?

The father was frozen at the table. The mother was pegged to the side of the staircase with forks and knives. Was there some clear indication that Mrs. Walkers head was entirely intact? I don't think we know this for sure.

It has never been Sylar's M.O. to kill normals. "There is nothing to gain from it, so why would I do it", says Sylar to the audience when he is agonizing over his prophesied role in the destruction of New York.

He killed one normal in the graphic novel to make sure he made his escape - but I think that's the only instance of it in Heroes...up until the death of the Car Thief man with a rock in Mexico, who was also killed to allow Sylar to prevent him from calling the police.

It was for this reason that I had always assumed he killed *both* of the Walkers for their abilities.

 

[Darkwolf71]

Well, he did kill the wrong cheerleader. It is entirely possible that he knew that someone in the Walker household had an ability but not who specifically. So, he killed Mr. & Mrs. blindly groping. This doesn't explain why he would have left Molly alive, but maybe he just couldn't find her.

 

[Mark]

By everything that happened in the show.

Ma Petrelli helps Claire because she is her daughter.
Nathan pays Firemommy to keep her mouth shut about her daughter.
Firemommy says Nathan is Claires daughter.

None of those things confirm that Claire is Nathan's daughter. Those only confirm that Nathan believes that Claire is his daughter and that Angela and trailerpark mom claim that Claire is his daughter.

Firemommy knows she had a daughter not a son. And her daughter could not be Elle because there is a 6 year difference between the two.

We do not know for a fact that she has had any children Trailerpark mom cannot be trusted to tell the truth. She may be lying about everything. It is even just as possible in the context of the show that she had Elle (who she gave up to the Company for experiments) and later had flyboy (who may have been switched with or without her knowledge, if she was not in possession of the knowledge of the sex of the baby before birth and not conscious during the birth). Or that someone else we have yet to meet had flyboy and that the Company paid her to blackmail Nathan's family. The truth is far from clear at this point.

Let us not forget that Claire and flyboy are about the same age. Why, also, have flyboy be someone who can fly? Why not have the new boyfriend with some other ability? They go out of their way to make sure that we know that abilties are passed down and then randomly decide that someone who is supposedly not related has the same ability as a major character that has been in the show since the beginning? With all of the abilities the writers might have chosen for the new boyfriend, we are to believe that the writers accidently chose an ability already in use without thinking what that might do to their series bible? I'm not convinced it is an accident.

In any event, trailerpark mom needs to be put in a room with Parkman for a half an hour so we can get some straight answers.

We have to assume the events in the show (and comic, if you consider it canon as well) are not lying to us. Otherwise, we can't assume anything, and Occam's Razor doesn't apply.

We have to make the distinction between an event in the show and what one character tells another. Even then, events within the show can be altered due to the time traveling element, though it seems the writers/producers are reluctant to do anything along those lines and have written Hiro to have a conscience about such things. Although, I would guess they are making sure we know something like that is possible by showing Hiro and Nakamura Sr. are against doing something like that precisely so that when they decide to do something later in the series the writers can claim they let us know it was possible early on even if they chose not to exploit it this early. Still, I don't think we will be seeing Denise Crosby showing up in season five claiming to be Angela's half-Romulan love child.

 

[Glyfair]

Why, also, have flyboy be someone who can fly? Why not have the new boyfriend with some other ability?

One of the points they made in interviews, just before the season started, was they wanted to suggest there are only a finite number of abilities to go around. Thus, you would see a lot of repeating of abilities.

That doesn't break your theory. However, it does make it a bit more shaky.

 

[Victim]

Let us not forget that Claire and flyboy are about the same age. Why, also, have flyboy be someone who can fly? Why not have the new boyfriend with some other ability? They go out of their way to make sure that we know that abilties are passed down and then randomly decide that someone who is supposedly not related has the same ability as a major character that has been in the show since the beginning? With all of the abilities the writers might have chosen for the new boyfriend, we are to believe that the writers accidently chose an ability already in use without thinking what that might do to their series bible? I'm not convinced it is an accident.

We only have 1 case of direct power inheritance, and a whole lot of "people with powers have children with powers," plus some powers seem to pop across the population randomly. For instance, Shanti apparently had a power, but there's no evidence that anyone else in the family does. So in other words, the show has not made an effort to show that abilities have been passed down.

 

[Mark]

One of the points they made in interviews, just before the season started, was they wanted to suggest there are only a finite number of abilities to go around. Thus, you would see a lot of repeating of abilities.

That doesn't break your theory. However, it does make it a bit more shaky.

Perhaps. It also may have been something they said in an interview so that when flyboy was introduced everyone did not assume it was Nathan's son. Still, have they shown any others with abilities identical to someone else in the show?

 

[Mark]

We only have 1 case of direct power inheritance, and a whole lot of "people with powers have children with powers," plus some powers seem to pop across the population randomly. For instance, Shanti apparently had a power, but there's no evidence that anyone else in the family does. So in other words, the show has not made an effort to show that abilities have been passed down.

Hiro has a power inherited from his father, only more powerful. Parkman has a power handed down from his father, only more powerful. In other words, the writers/producers have made an effort to show this as possible and it may be part of the series bible. We will have to see if this is something on which guessers can hang their hat or just something they did as a fluke, twice. I suspect more of that will become evident as the series ties more of the story lines together and wraps more and more of their loose ends up.

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

Hiro has a power inherited from his father, only more powerful.

Huh?

We never found out whatever his father could do. There was the assumption that his father was Kensei, hence long life, etc...but that was long before Season 2 started, and its definitely not true.

In fact, of the older generation of heroes, we ONLY know the power of Adam and Parkman's father.

Kind of seems like you're reaching a little too hard to make everyone connected. I mean, they ARE connected in the sense that they're all 'special', but I don't think that also means everyone needs to be related. In fact, for me, that would cheapen it a great deal.